There’s a Congressional candidate in Iowa Ohio who’s having a bit of a publicity problem over his hobby. It turns out that Rich Iott likes taking part in historic re-enactments, including World War II, and sometimes he takes the part of a German.
In similar news, Electronic Arts has tweaked its latest iteration of its “Medal Of Honor” video game. In the Afghanistan scenarios, players could choose to play on the Coalition side or the Taliban side — and people didn’t like the idea of gamers taking on the role of the Taliban.
I’ve been a gamer of various sorts most of my life. Not so much video games, but board games, trading-card games, and role-playing games. In a lot of those games, conflict is essential — player vs. player or players vs. the game master.
And in a lot of cases, that means that I’ve had to play as the bad guy. In “Fighting Steel,” a World War II naval surface warfare game, I’ve played on all four sides — American, British, German, and Japanese sides. In other World War II games, I’ve occasionally taken the side of the Nazis.
It’s a fact of gaming. If there are bad guys, sooner or later you’re going to have to play them. Because without bad guys, there’s no one for the good guys to fight.
In one Tom Clancy novel, the United States is under attack from a biological weapon (weaponized Ebola). One of the experts from the Army brings up the time he developed a plan to carry out just such an attack against the US as part of an exercise. Another character is appalled — here’s a United States Army doctor who’s planned out, in detail, how to kill millions of Americans.
The response is simple: attack and defense are two sides of the same coin. To properly develop a defense, one needs to face a realistic plan for attack — the more effective, the better. And that means that those who are tasked with defending us have to understand how to best attack.
The players in Medal Of Honor aren’t that concerned with the politics of the actual conflict in Afghanistan. They’re more interested in testing themselves against other players. And the game designers at EA are not interested in the politics of the war, either — they’re trying to keep players’ interest by using a real-world model. And their concern isn’t in portraying the politics of the fight, but balancing faithfulness to the reality of the situation with game balance, giving each side an equal chance to win.
A little while ago, some folks brought up the TV series “Hogan’s Heroes.” A lot of people had a problem with a comedy set in a Nazi prisoner-of-war camp (not a concentration camp) and using Nazis as sources of humor.
By an odd coincidence, nearly all the major German characters were played by Jews. Col. Klink, Sgt. Schultz, General Burkhalter, and Major Hochstetter were all portrayed by Jewish actors. Further, three of them had fled Nazi Germany, and a fourth actor — Robert Clary, who played Corporal LeBeau — had actually spent three years in a Nazi concentration camp.
Werner Klemperer, the actor who played Col. Klink, had a few conditions before he took the role. He insisted that Klink be a lackluster Nazi, and that he never be allowed to “win.”
So, what do Mr. Iott’s historical recreations, computer games, war games, and “Hogan’s Heroes” all have in common? They’re all make-believe. They all recreate actual historical conflicts, with people assuming the roles of participants in those conflicts.
And in each case, some people will have to take on the roles of the good guys and bad guys. It’s the way the game is played. You can’t be a hero unless you have a villain to defeat — and the tougher the villain, the greater the triumph.
One final point: at their core, the players all know that they’re just playing. They know it’s make-believe. They know they’re just playing a role. The ones to worry about are those who actually take things seriously — the Neo-Nazis, the racial supremacists, the actual terrorists.
And, to a lesser degree, those who have trouble separating the fantasy from reality. They’re most found among those who get hysterical about the fantasy — and they’re most often not actually players.
Update: I forgot to insert this one paragraph:
One of the most fun games I’ve played in the last year required me to portray a drunken Communist gnome on a sinking nuclear submarine. I’m a six-foot-tall teetotaling capitalist, but that game is seriously nuts. I’ve also played a game where I was a brain-eating zombie, and that was also a fun (except when I got blasted in the face with the shotgun).
We have a new contestant Magic something or the other, his new trick reading the minds of conservatives. Here’s the deal there is so much dirty laudry in the democrat closet that no one needs to screw around with something so stupid as which side a candidate played in a war reenactment. I’ve pointed out some of the nastiness that surround Obama but so far no commentary from the enlightened ones here.
Magic Logician – how do you know that those are his “true colors”?
I’ll grant that performing as an SS is not the smartest thing to do, but considering that this man also re-enacted American soldiers, ho can you claim that the SS re-enactment reveals his “true colors”?
And if a Dem candidate re-enacted something wearing Viet Cong pajamas or an NVA uniform, I wouldn’t be too concerned, even if it was John Francois Kerry.
First off, someone above beat me to it. George Soros, the hero of the left such as Dane and Galoob, is a direct link to the Nazi’s and their machine but they embrace him anyway. Yet they cannot stand someone that actually does military re-enactments like they do for WWII, WWI and the Civil War. Although I don’t get the motivation, I do know that all participants are history lovers and pretty much know the casualties of the sides they are representing. Of course the left does not understand history, as they constantly try to rewrite it all the time. Plus the uneducated massed of the left probably do not even know what Nazi is or SS for that matter. At most they know “it’s bad” but that is it. Of course the liberal’s like Dane have to play the asshole role even though they understand what re-enacters do. You lefty fellow’s are pretty shallow, juvenile group. ww
I’ll grant that performing as an SS is not the smartest thing to do
Gee, do ya think so? Look, if there really is a pic of a Democratic candidate (or office holder) in Vietcong pajamas (BTW, the NVA was the formal army; the Vietcong were irregulars drawn mainly from the South), I’d be at the head of the line telling him to get the hell out of there.
His offense wouldn’t be crypto-communism, it would be felony stupidity. But I guess the wingnut support for this guy proves something I’ve always said to people: “It’s impossible to embarrass a dog or a Republican.”
ML –
“In any case, I have no doubt that if a Democratic candidate popped up in a Vietcong costume at a reenactment, the wingnuts would have a field day with it, just like the Democrats are having with this Republican showing his true colors.”
So, in your view, a Democrat found as a VC re-enactor is showing his true colors. A very revealing statement, and it explains why you are ready to paint this candidate with that brush. Don’t try to argue that I’m misinterpreting – your paragraph clearly implies that very thing.
“By the way, why couldn’t he have played an American soldier in the reenactments?”
Already answered at least once, to those paying attention. To quote #39, “A reenactment without both sides is just a parade.”
You might want to change screen names – your current one is misleading. “Logic” is nowhere to be found in your statements.
I’ve met people who played German re-enactors and they’re some of the most patriotic Americans. They do a valuable service by highlighting the heroism of our own boys. Ditto for those portraying Rebs and Yanks in CW re-enactments, including those I was with at Wilson’s Creek in ’91.
A pox on you libs who continually scream about “wingnuts.” Sod off, swampy.
At least he is role playing. Barry is really a marxist and he aint acting.
Let’s see… the most frequent and popular Hitler impersonator alive today has to be Mel Brooks. I guess he’s a real Nazi, too.
And I recall a Hogan’s Heroes where Larry Hovis impersonated Hitler.
Amazing how many people who claim to represent the “reality based community” can’t separate play-acting with actual beliefs…
J.
J – The great comic Jack Benny wore a Nazi uniform in 1942’s To Be or Not To Be with Carol Lombard. Benny’s father, a Jew, was utterly outraged, but Benny begged his dad to watch the film — which he did, and he understood instantly that his son only wore that uniform to tell a terrific story of helping people escape from the Nazis.
(If you haven’t seen this movie, which sadly was Carol Lombard’s last, you really should. It’s a masterpiece, IMHO.)
From the website of the “reenactor group” this dumbass belongs to:
“Nazi Germany had no problem in recruiting the multitudes of volunteers willing to lay down their lives to ensure a “Nwe and Free Europe,” free of the threat of Communism. National Socialism was seen by many in Holland, Denmark, Norway, Finland, and other eastern European and Balkan countries as the protector of personal freedom and their very way of life, despite the true underlying totalitarian (and quite twisted, in most cases) nature of the movement. Regardless, thousands upon thousands of valiant men died defending their respective countries in the name of a better tomorrow. We salute these idealists; no matter how unsavory the Nazi government was, the front-line soldiers of the Waffen-SS (in particular the foreign volunteers) gave their lives for their loved ones and a basic desire to be free.”
NOW do you get it, Wizbangers? This guy isn’t playing Nazi because “somebody had to.” He’s doing it because he “salutes these idealists.”
And by “idealists” he means “traitorous thugs who joined the armed forces of their enemies because of a twisted racist ideology.”
In other words, he’s the one re-writing history, changing traitors into idealists. What a sick fuck. And he’s got his KID believing the fucking Waffen -SS were fucking IDEALISTIC HEROES. And you guys are defending him.
I mean, really. Do any of you geniuses believe the fucking Waffen-SS was fighting “to be free???!!??”
It’s not the dressing up that bothers me. I understand reenactments. It’s that paragraph from that website. How could anybody belong to a group that spouts romanticised whitewashed horseshit like that? If Iott isn’t too evil to be in Congress, he’s way too stoooopid.
It’s late, and I don’t feel like hashing out a gazillion arguments. But considering this thread veered into geekdom, I give you three words:
Nazi Re-enactor Furries.
Good evening.
Bruce –
Sorry, that ship sailed a few hours back. Dane went off-shift, poor sucker’s likely to have been fired because he couldn’t come up with ANYTHING viable on this. They’ll have to get some other poor schlub to come on as Dane and start screaming ‘RAAAACIST!’ and ‘NAZI!!!!!’ – here’s hoping he’s got more entertainment value than the last one.
Look, I know how the left is supposed to be so ‘tolerant’, and so open-minded. I’ve dated and cohabitated for a while with a self-proclaimed Wiccan, (didn’t end well, she ended up stealing my car when she got tired of living in the middle of nowhere) and I also was a member of the SCA for a few years. And a Mensa member, as well as done the D&D thing. This doesn’t mean I want to bring back the Middle Ages or kings or the idea of fealty to feudal lords, or go adventuring in deep caverns looking for goblins and gelatinous cubes to slay while wearing leather armor and using a rusty sword. (Just until I can kill a troll and find something better, of course.)
The Mensans? Mostly harmless, as Douglas Adams described the Earth in Hitchhiker’s Guide To The Galaxy. I will say, however, the women were as a whole somewhat less crazy than in the SCA and if you clean up well the chances of hooking up are really good. Even met my wife at a Mensa event – her first, and we were just what each other was looking for. Quit Mensa shortly after that – didn’t need to look any further…
Also, I understand it’s the political season, and Democratic candidates are avoiding being seen with Obama. The House is likely to flip, and the Senat’s getting pretty close to it. You’re frustrated, and angry, and looking for something, ANYTHING, you can use to get your mojo back, to get some sort of political momentum going.
And it’s just not happening. The wheels are spinning like some guy from southern CA trying to drive on snow-covered ice in North Dakota. You got no traction, and you don’t understand why.
Tell ya what – try showing some of the same vaunted tolerance you show any Democratic candidate. Try campaigning on the actual issues, instead of looking for shit in people’s background that isn’t relevant. And no – this isn’t relevant. I wouldn’t think it relevant for a Democrat, either – and unless I’m wrong, neither would you.
Maybe it’s time to give up the ‘reality-based’ thinking, Bruce. It’s dug us a deep damn hole, and a lot of folks that used to buy it are just abandoning it. Just maybe it’s time to rethink a few things.
Nazi Re-enactor Furries?
AAAAAGGGGHHHH!
I shall smite you with my +12 Rattan Sword of Blazing Fury, James H! Roll 2d6, and prepare to die!
I got me Force Grip, JLaw. Kinda like kung fu grip, but much more personal. I find your lack of faith disturbing …
I don’t mean to be rude, but who asked for your life story, Mr Lawson?
I just joined this thread to point out that this dude Iott isn’t just your regular run-of-the-mill reenactor. He and his friends apparently (according to their website, at least) CELEBRATE the “idealism” and “heroism’ of the Waffen-SS. The Waffen. Fucking. SS.
I don’t live in Armpit, Ohio, or Athlete’s Foot, Iowa, or whatever godforsaken district Iott is running in, so I guess that’s why I got a lecture on how this story and my reaction to it proves that reality-based thinking is so last year, or something.
While we’re telling stories, let me tell you about when I was an area supervisor for a chain of restaurants. One of my managers was into CW reenacting. One Saturday he had scheduled a store meeting, and decided that it would be appropriate to show up (since he was going to a reenactment that afternoon) in his Confederate major’s uniform. He was too fucking clueless to anticipate that some of his employees would be offended.
Kinda like how I feel about this dude. As the son of a WW2 vet, and nephew of 3 WW2 vets who were actually SHOT AT by the heroes and idealists in the Nazi army, I kinda like my history to reflect, you know, what really happened in WW2. And what really happened is that anybody from Occupied Europe who joined the SS was a traitor, not a hero.
And I’m just spitballin’ here, but are there WW2 reenactments in Ohio in which lots of guys dress up as SS, and lots of other guys dress up as Soviet soldiers? Because that’s what Iott’s reenactor website seems to be so proud of these heroes about – that they killed a lot of conscript Red Army soldiers. Or do Iott and his friends just dress up as Nazis and prance around in their authentic uniforms without DOING any actual, you know, reenacting?
Hey Bruce I live in Ohio and don’t really appreciate the slap in the face insult much. So why don’t you crawl back into what ever inner city shit hole you live in and leave the grown ups alone.
Hey, no offense, John. Everybody’s from somewhere. And, no, Raleigh, NC isn’t exactly an “inner-city shithole.”
But if all you got from my comment was insulted by a reference to an imaginary Armpit, Ohio, spare me the “leave the grown ups alone” bit. Are you drunk?
no actually Bruce I got that you’re a condsending ass, but I guess grown ups can be that way too. And Yes I read all the blather you spouted and most of it was just you trying to manage the worst possible spin. But you know if this is a really big deal to you great have a party tell your friends, be outraged and accuse everyone you can find of being a nazi or a sympathizer. It’s a nice vocation for you.
Hey, none taken, Bruce. I’m sure YOUR background is certainly sterile enough to run for office, isn’t it?
Point I’m trying to make, and that you seem to have missed, is that if you dig hard enough into everyone’s life you’re going to find something that’ll be useful to smear them with. You can spin it, you can deliberately misinterpret it, (OMG! She’s a witch! Burn her! He’s a Nazi! Don’t vote for him!) you can do what you please. So go ahead, shout “Hey, this person’s vile and evil and nasty! Don’t vote for them!”
Forgive us if we don’t agree – if you can. And if you can’t, well… that’s too damn bad, and totally typical of the ‘forgiving, tolerant’ left as we’ve come to know them all too well.
You’ve got your opinion, and you seem to be in the minority on it. In fact, overall the left seems to be much more in the minority now than it used to be. I think that’s because a lot of people who were Democrats or independents who voted for Democrats have looked at what’s gone on, and what’s been promised, and what the folks on the left have said and been saying – and have had enough.
Enough of the lies, enough of the spin, enough of the smearing, enough of the attempts to persuade people that after 4 years of control of the House and Senate and two years after electing a Democratic President that somehow, some way, even when you’ve got CONTROL of the legislative process SOMEHOW it’s STILL all Bush’s fault when something goes awry! Every fucking misstep, every idiotic program, every massive expansion of debt for the last 4 years – it’s ALL the fault of the Republicans!
And it might even have worked this election cycle, if it hadn’t been for those damned idiots last year who kept ignoring their own constituents at the town hall meetings on Obamacare. That woke people up – they started looking and didn’t care for what they saw.
All they saw coming from the left was a whole lot of money going out to the well-connected, ‘stimulus’ programs that didn’t create jobs, miserably high gas prices while the folks in Washington piously proclaimed it was their DUTY to suffer to keep carbon emissions down to keep the world from boiling – they saw lies and self-serving blame and spin month after month after month…
And they’re saying… “Enough.” Soon (barring any catastrophe that delays the vote) they’re going to vote.
A message will be sent to Washington with that vote – and I don’t think Obama’s going to appreciate the content at all.
James H –
LOL!
Bruce,
When reading your post, and if one was inclined, they could infer, from your statements, that you were pre-disposed to dismiss those in “flyover” country. Perhaps you hold a condescending view of those that don’t live in hip urban areas or share a certain political viewpoint?
I really don’t think you feel that, and the reference to “armpit” and “Athelets Foot” were attempts to illustrate your disregard for happenings outside your own immediate district/interests, yet I hope you see how easy it is to take any point of conversation, and if someone disagrees with you, to run with it in a different direction than was intended.
This is why the leftists are losing so much ground, they refuse to run on their records knowing the American people have rejected it and are motivated to remove them from office, their only recourse is personal attacks, most of them fabricated.
You should really focus on this example the next time you come on, grab a statement and “run” with it to try and make a political point.
What I find interesting is that the liberals here seem to be saying that this association of Lott’s is a disqualifier makes him unfit for office or something, but associations don’t have the same effect on their chosen candidates/elected officials. All on has to do is look at the lack of concern over Obama’s associations.
And it’s not the Armpit or Altetes foot references it’s the asumption on Bruce’s part that these places are “hell holes” Please Jay Tea or someone start a post on all the associations of liberals so the rest of us can join in the outrage.
I find it disgusting that Bruce trades on the military service of his father and uncles to promote his own chickenshit brand of “patriotism”. If you didn’t walk the walk Bruce, STFU.
So, now politics dictate we must go thru each and every candidates past to find out what they participated in? Going to be interesting to find out what each did in kindergarten thru adulthood. School plays, what songs did they sing, who was their favorite folk singer. Wow! What if you were one of the “bad witches” in the Wizard of Oz? Sure would cancel my vote. I don’t know tho, killing someone by throwing water on them would make one guilty of manslaughter at least wouldn’t it?
I cast the Polar Kraken on Dane, and a fireball at magic-loogie!! Oh well, didn’t want to run for public office anyway.
Let me be clear, point-missers and willful point-ignorers: I don’t give a shit if the guy wants to dress up as a Nazi to participate in a reenactment because, well, SOMEBODY’S gotta play the Nazis. I wouldn’t vote for the guy, but I don’t think dressing up disqualifies him for office.
No, it’s the blurb on the website claiming that traitors from occupied countries who served in the Waffen-SS were “idealists” fighting to “protect their way of life” that makes me puke. And he’s not running away from that blurb, either; Anderson Cooper grilled him about it and he dug in, proving, in my mind, he’s a sick fuck with no more understanding of history than, say, you geniuses.
So, no, playing a bad witch in “Wizard of Oz” is not comparable to belonging for years to an organization thar celebrates the “heroism and idealism” of Nazi traitors from occupied Europe.
Oh, and Olsoljer? Kiss my ass. I’ll express opinions about patriotism if I wish, whether I have “walked the walk” to your satisfaction or not. Kinda what makes America great, ain’t it? Or do only veterans, such as you anonymously claim to be, get to express an opinion on anything national-security-related?
Gee Brucie, I might be offended by your comment if I thought you had any basis for your opinions. While you certainly have the right to say what you want, your credibility certainly leaves a lot to be desired.
You might want to lock your doors and turn off your lights on Oct 31 (Halloween) I would hate to hear you shot a 6 year old for dressing like an arab.
Here’ let me fix that for you, Lawson:
James H –
Hurr!
What makes you think we missed your point Bruce, the fact it doesn’t move our opinions? I know you think we’re all rubes and dopes but you’ve spelled out your point a number of times clearly enough, it’s not that we miss the point it’s that we don’t care about.
“What makes you think we missed your point Bruce, the fact it doesn’t move our opinions? “
I think it’s because you’ve repeatedly avoided addressing his point.
But that’s just my “opinion.”
Why would I bother to address his point when his outrage seems so selective. But OK here goes I understand the point you think this organization and therefore by association this candidate is a nazi (by the way that has been addressed here a few times by me and other’s but since you seemed to miss the point I’ll repeat it here) The simple fact is I think differently.
Ah, but WHY do you think differently, John?
Can you explain why a guy who thinks traitors from occupied countries who joined the armed forces of their occupiers should be “saluted” as “heroes” and “idealists” deserves to be a member of the US Congress? Why a guy who likes to dress up and pretend to BE one of these traitors deserves that honor?
Because I can’t.
Let me ask you a horrifying hypothetical, John. Suppose the Chinese army invaded America to “save us from Islamic terrorism.” Far-fetched, I know, but stick with me. Now, suppose your next-door neighbor, scared to death of Muslims, joined an elite unit of the Chinese army.
Would your next-door neighbor be a “hero and an idealist?” Or would he be a “traitor?” And in 60 years, would you like to see grown men dressed up in his uniform celebrating his deeds? Would you like to see one of them in Congress?
And suppose monkees fly out of my ass, what the hell are you talking about Bruce? Like I said your outrage is too selective, if you look at Lotts opponent you’ll find a liberal that thinks Iraq terrorist are freedom fighters, just like the american founding fathers. I don’t see you jumping up and down about that.
Perhaps if that was the subject of the post, Genius.
Still avoiding the issue, I see. Monkeys flying out of your ass, indeed.
I’ll ask one more time, then I’m done with you, John: Is a man who joins the armed forces of the nation that invades and occupies his own a traitor or an idealist? And is an idiot who “salutes” that man 65 years later (by dressing up in his snazzy uniform) a dumbass or not? And would he get your vote?
No Bruce I did not avoid the subject I disagreed with you get over it, I’m not trying to convince you of anything, I would never persume that someone as stupid as me could ever change your views. I bring up Lott’s opponent only to demonstrate your selective outrage. So for the last time I don’t think this has any effect on Lott’s fitness for office OK? You think it does, great good for you I’m happy for you. In MY OPINION you only care about this because it gives you something to beat up a republican about.
And so I won’t get accused of not addressing your point, given the choice between a terriorist loving democrat and rebulican that likes to participate in war games I’ll take the republican. See how easy it is to paint the ugliest picture imaginable?
You’re not that good at this, are you, John?
That’s OK. Arguing on the internet’s not for everyone. But here’s a hint: sticking your fingers in your ears and refusing to address an opponent’s point, simply saying, “I disagree,” but not saying why, isn’t how it’s done.
But don’t give up hope. Continue reading Wizbang, and pay special attention when Jay Tea joins a comment thread. He’s typically just as wrong as you are here, but his comments are usually, at least, clever and amusing. Not like yours, which just sound angry and willfully ignorant.
That’s right Bruce like I said I’m just dumb hick from some hell hole in Ohio. But you on the other hand are so smart and so well informed you can’t even convince a hick like me to accept your assine position. Thanks ever so for sharing you superior intellect with me and giving me advice on how to conduct myself. Could you be any more condesending?
OK Bruce I give up, you are much better at insulting people than I am so I won’t try any more. Instead I will try to explain why I don’t think this particular thing is a disqualifier.
I understand completely what you’re saying I know what the web site says. I read the story. My first problem with this line of attack is that it assumes guilt by association, there is nothing that I’ve seen that indicated Lott is anything but a loyal american that wants to run for public office, he’s not said or done anything to indicate otherwise. There is something you find objectionable on a 3rd party web sight, not Lott’s web sight, not the Ohio Rupublican party web sight. The people that run the war reenactment group have decided they understand the motives of occupied territory ss voluteers, they may have it completely wrong. They may have a former memeber who has told them his motivations. They may have read some history somewhere that indicates this, I have no idea. Second I find there is much more evidence to suggest that Lott is a geek that likes war games, he’s done a lot of them with I assume lots of other groups. My problem with the attacks is that it’s a low form of politics. Lott’s opponent said something that was at best inartful, cvomparing Iraq insugents with the founding fathers, as a political opponent it would be great fun to jump all over her and make her explain it 10 different ways until she said something else equally as stupid that we could hang around her neck. The truth is I don’t think she’s a terrorist supporter any more than I think Lott loves nazis. And finally this level of politics leaves our courntry run by the likes of Reid, Pelosi, and you’re faviorite republicans (take your pick most of them are just as bad as liberal politicans). If we ever want real leadership we have to stop attacking good people in this fashion. So I know you’ll disagree and that’s fine I’m not attempting to convince you, honestly.
Last, I think we got off on the wrong foot because I took offense at your hell hole comment. Like our friends the politicians it’s easy to read motivations for the oppostition.
Thank you, John. Thanks for finally addressing my objection. Your reply, when I finally got it, was pretty well thought-out and makes sense. Not that hard, really, huh?
But where you and I are still gonna disagree is that Iott (not Lott, Iott) is, in interviews, DEFENDING the remarks on the website in question. In other words, this candidate for Congress knows so little about history and patriotism that he believes that sick racist traitors were “idealists” and “heroes,” not the traitors they were.
Think about it, John. What do you suppose the opinion of the Dutch, Norwegian, Danish, etc. governments were about these idealists after the war? You think they recognized them for their idealism and heroism in fighting for the other side?
And here, 65 years later, is an organization that not only excuses but exalts these scumbags. And a candidate for Congress is a leading member of that organization, and just loves dressing up and playing games in their shameful uniforms.
But hey, if you live in his district, knock yourself out, vote for him.
By the way, I AM curious to know if there WERE any reenactments, or if these douchebags just took photos in their authentic snazzy Nazi uniforms. Because I can see how “somebody had to play the Nazis.” But what patriotic Ohioans dressed up in SOVIET FUCKING UNIFORMS?
Bruce, I have a question for you. Which do you find worse: dressing up and taking on the role of a Nazi, or associating with, working with, and socializing with a real-life terrorist who attempted to overthrow the US government?
J.
Well, you know, Mr Tea, if Iott was friends with an elderly veteran of the Waffen-SS who had gone through the legal system of the country he betrayed, (perhaps getting off on a technicality) I wouldn’t be particularly outraged.
But that’s not the case here. Here we have Iott’s organization claiming traitors were idealists and play-acting their “heroic” roles in one of the darkest chapters in Western history. And we have Iott defending that organization’s claim.
Now, when you show me pictures of Obama dressing up in tie-dyes and bell bottoms and reenacting a pipe-bombing, claiming Ayers was an “idealist” fighting to “defend his way of life” I’ll agree that the situations are equivalent.
Until then, you’re apparently just as blind to the obvious truth of the matter as John here.
I will say that, if you want to ask which group was closer to being “idealists” – the Weather Underground or the Waffen-SS – I’ll vote for Ayers and friends.
Bruce I tried I won’t try again. You just simply can not keep from talking down to me can you?
John, I expressed impatience that it took so long for you to address my point. I don’t know why you insist on being offended. Sarcasm is a standard weapon when arguing on political blogs. I don’t “look down” on you as a personal matter. Who the hell am I to look down on anybody?
Man up, get over your inferiority complex, and argue with some conviction. Don’t pussy out with your “Waah, that mean elitist liberal is picking on me” bullshit.
You don’t understand why I’m offened, are you kidding. You’ve done nothing but talk down to me, you intend it as personal insult but think I shouldn’t take it as such. You’re insulting and condescending and you don’t understand why someone would be offened. You just called me a pussy, was that intended to offened or should I not take it personally? You’re just a smug prick with an opinion and a computer. Do you feel like a tough guy calling someone a pussy on a internet blog?
OK, John, I’ll try to take it easy on you next time you address me.
Because remember who insulted whom first on this thread. I believe your words had something to do with “letting the grown ups talk,” am I right?
You knew you were speaking to a sarcastic prick when you chose to address me in this thread. Then you get offended when I remain the same sarcastic prick I was when you made your pathetic “let the grown ups talk” attempt at snark. Don’t get pissed off when you find yourself outmatched, dude.
This internet arguing stuff is only a game, not meant (at least by me) to be taken all that seriously. Those who are prone to hurt widdle feewings probably should go fishing, or flying remote control planes, or playing Scrabble or something.
In other words, yeah, you’re a pussy, apparently. Be offended now.
Ok Brucie go tell your boy friend how tough you are that you called someone a pussy on the internet. Yes you’ve out matched me because you’re a much bigger prick than I am, it must make you proud. You must have a happy life, couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.