Note: This post is now closed to new comments. The Metzger discussion will continue in our new Wizbang Forum, where there is a thread devoted to Metzger. Registration is required to post on our new vBulliten powered forums. We’re fairly certain that the new forum system will be more practical for this type of extended discussion…
In the coming weeks we’ll updated to look of the forums to more closely match the new Wizbang design.
DM: Me, too! Catching the kidnappers would not only end suffering but imagine the happiness felt around the world when it comes to light that there really is a Santa Claus, Tooth Fairy and Easter Bunny. Those are the abductors, right? The Easter Bunny used ether gas to put Jill in a trance and she kicked the Tooth Fairy’s @ss to escape (hope the tooth fairy isn’t missing any teeth). I can’t wait to see the look on all the pessimists faces when they find out that there really IS a Santa. Boy will THEY be sorry to have ever questioned fairy tales!
MM: Now, that made me lmao! I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I thought there really was a Santa Claus 🙁 and all this time I have been mad at the tooth fairy for never bringing me any more money 🙁 and then who exactly IS bringing me Easter candy each year??? 🙁 how disappointing (sigh). Does this mean Shrek doesn’t exist either? I love Shrek! oh no – not Nemo too 🙁
Keep up the good work Deb G.
I haven’t visited you lately, but you are certainly hinting at a ‘conspiracy’ as I predicted. But the “not a human” step reeks of your disapointment after spending so much time here.
How do you know Jill is the person screwing this whole thing up?
Maybe, just maybe, somebody with some power along the way was convinced of her guilt and it turns out their intuition was wrong. Maybe.
Sickening: You could be right. MAYBE, just maybe someone with power is making her look guilty. It does not explain her giving the bomb in pocket story, kidnapping, etc…until the Embassy told her to stop talking. This certainly could be a conspiracy – agreed. The FBI will most likely shed more light on that one. Then again, we all know what happened to John Hinkley right?????
Please someone tell me Santa really does exist….
US Mil types only,
For what its worth;
This is the third time I have posted a comment here, it will be my last.
My first comment simply cautioned any military or DoD civilians posting comments here not to use USG computers during duty while in the workplace. It was directed to no one individual specifically, however Deb-G and a crew of others chose to make light of it. No big deal we all should have thick skin if we are going to play the game.
My second comment warned some Jeth person to back off collecting personal info about Deb.
There are a lot of military reading and or posting comments here because they want the truth to come out.
Step back and consider that anyone in the world can review all the postings on this blog site.
Are we living up to our professional duties and responsibilities or are we making asses’ of ourselves by mocking / bashing each other on the www?
Not trying to sound to prudish as I enjoy a joke just like everyone else.
But can we please let up on the personal attacks and stick to the subject of JM’s alleged abduction.
Checks in the mail, choppers inbound, see you on the high ground.
Why waste your energy here? Don’t you have better things to do than slander and make unsubstantiated claims about an individual, her family, and others on this blog? I don’t think you would do this if not for the veil of anonymity. I am quite certain that if face to face, Jill Metzger would probably kick your ass.
Author: Flytrap
I invite Jill to try to kick my ass.
But can we please let up on the personal attacks and stick to the subject of JM’s alleged abduction.
Checks in the mail, choppers inbound, see you on the high ground.
Author: br
I waste my energy here because until official explanation is made this is the only place conversation of her situation and circumstances are being discussed. There are certain behaviors and conduct military members’ shall not engage in and the consequences of accomplishing such deeds is identified in military law (UCMJ). The UCMJ identifies distinctly what military members are not to do and the consequences if such deeds are accomplished.
Discussing what it means if a military member did a shalt not do deed punishable by military law is not bearing false witness and making untrue statement with intent to cause harm by slandering and defaming when the event of public knowledge brings onto legitimate question of if she did or she did not act contrary to the good conduct and good behavior expected of a military member. My interest is if her deeds were of UCMJ shalt not do and if done will be punished, but rather what will competent military authority determine the appropriate consequences will be or will not be.
For me the interest is not Jill Metzger, but the moral competencies of persons appointed to key leadership and command duty positions. Do they fulfill their duties with fairness and desire all military members be held accountable to have good behavior and conduct or is responsibility and accountability for personal actions and deeds selectively applied in a manner that shows favoritism of a chosen elite. Perhaps protecting the reputation of the Department of the Air Force is more important than integrity to do the right or best corrective action.
It is clear current explanation of abduction and escape is not a believable reasonable explanation and this explanation brings with it high probability the commissioned officer acted so contrary to the good conduct and behavior expected of a military member, that the deeds speculated of being accomplished included those forbidden deeds that bring with them considerable potential UCMJ punishment.
There is also the social issue of woman serving in the military. A visit to any place of military conversation has argument there is no biological, physiological, and athletic (strenght, endurance, resilience) ability reason that prevents gender from serving in direct combat. The strongest argument given is modern medicine has given the female gender control of their bodies, specifically the ability to prevent pregnancy in the ranks so it does not and will not impair a combat units readiness to deploy its full troop strength to engage the enemy.
Considering becoming or being pregnant is not a matter of military concern except for restricting being present and ready to deploy, there is reasonable expectation the medical condition of being pregnancy should be avoided while deployed and it is understood becoming pregnant while deployed results in immediate release from the deployment tasking, consequently the military capability deployed to confront and engage the enemy is dependent on the expectation the female should not and will not get pregnant while deployed.
There is no military law saying the military member of female gender shalt not get pregnant or shalt not have an abortion, so the lack of shalt not brings into considerable concern of if she got pregnant why didn’t she take action to disclose so she would be sent home to deal with it and if she desired an abortion why did she go AWOL to conceal both the pregnancy and the abortion.
If suspicions and rumors are found to have truth, this disclosure will bring into open public discussion significant concerns as it did not involve a young adult female with little more than perhaps a high school education, but highly decorated and highly educated female who had already served 12-years of military service who having significant rank and grade of being a field grade officer was appointed into a key leadership if not a command duty position at a deployed location in an imminent danger pay location that was supporting combat operations. She should have known better and if she lacked the medical technology to avoid becoming pregnancy, she should have had the self discipline not to have sex that might result in becoming pregnant during the period she was deployed.
I am interested in hearing from anyone who understands the grand jury system. We know that Jill testified in front of a grand jury in Alexandria, VA on 5 October. What does that mean, exactly? Here’s what I learned on Wikipedia:
“A grand jury is part of the system of checks and balances, preventing a case from going to trial on a prosecutor’s bare word. It, as an impartial panel of ordinary citizens, must first decide whether there exists reasonable cause or probable cause to believe that a crime has been committed. The grand jury can compel witnesses to testify before them. Unlike the trial itself, the grand jury’s proceedings are secret; the defendant and his or her counsel are generally not present for other witnesses’ testimony. The grand jury’s decision is either a “true bill,” there is a case to answer, or a “no true bill.” Jurors typically are drawn from the same pool of citizens as a petit jury, and participate for a specific time period…..In all U.S. jurisdictions retaining the grand jury, the defendant has the right under the Fifth Amendment not to give self-incriminating testimony. However, the prosecutor can call the defendant to testify and require the defendant to assert the right on a question-by-question basis, which is prohibited in jury trials unless the defendant has voluntarily testified on his own behalf. Other evidentiary rules applicable to trials (such as the hearsay rule) are generally not applicable to grand jury proceedings.”
So do we surmise that the grand jury proceedings were to determine whether there was a crime perpetrated AGAINST Jill, or whether she is to be CHARGED with a crime? It was held only a few weeks after her return, so it makes more sense that it was done to determine whether there was, in fact, a crime committed AGAINST Jill. The fact-finding for a crime Jill is accused of committing would take a lot longer, I’d think, and they’d have to call witnesses from Kyrgyzstan and Manas. The grand jury proceedings are all secret, but they will either come back with a “true bill” finding, which means there’s enough evidence for a trial (or an investigation?), or a “no true bill” which means there’s not. How long would that take? Would that finding be released to the public?
How usual is this grand jury proceeding for victims of foreign kidnappings? Is it a routine thing done before an investigation can start? Or is it really a strong sign that Jill’s story is very fishy?
A while ago, I suggested that Borat abducted Jill Metzger in Kyrgyzstan. He sneaked into Bishkek from Kazakhstan, kicked that egg-head chubby bloke from US Embassy in nuts, enduced trance and grabbed Jill and was off to Kazakhstan in his Volkswagen minivan.
Just checked Borat Sogdiev’s website out, where he is threatening to dethrone Dubya.
Well, all this makes me think that Borat is in conspiracy with George Soros to overtake US.
And JM abduction is the part of this plot.
http://www.borat2008.com/
I am sick and tired of seeing a country as prosperous as the US rot under the reign of the Bush royal family. It’s a 21st century and the American roads are still not capable of supporting camels! Jews are still allowed to marry. An average American still can’t afford having rat meat for dinner and gypsies are allowed to wear pants.
USA claims to be a super power but even Stalin would laugh at the US war of terror. Bush has failed to deploy the war elephants to Baghdad. He then made another mistake and deployed soldiers into the field without women who were strong enough to carry them into the battlefield. I would have understood if he at least supplied them with horses.
Then look at Social Security and Medicare. We spend hundreds of billions of dollars to support the old people. Kazakhstan may be a third world country but it has found the solution years ago. The solution is simple: shoot them or send them to the great country of Florida.
Who would have thought that the second best country in the world after Kazakhstan would have the ugliest women in the world? While I realize that most of the ugly women came from West Virginia and are related to the Bush family, I think we should change the law and make it illegal for the ugly and stupid people to mate. Celebrties such as Sacha Baron Cohen should be an exception to this rule.
I am here to fix this system! If you don’t vote for me, I will take power!
For you conspiracy buffs — maybe JM was entangled in some kind of smuggling operation that was using Manas
http://www.madcowprod.com/10252006.html
“I hope that the investigators and/or Kyrgyz police catch the kidnappers as soon as possible, which will ease everyone’s suffering.
Posted by: DM at October 25, 2006 03:54 PM”
DM: For do that Jill Major Girl must draw better picture of criminals. Kyrgyz Warlord complain no good bandits picture Jill gave them, we complain because of its Mission impossible-II. To go Europea for catch criminal Kyrgyz Warlord have no visa. We needs good pictures and visa for issue justice they criminal.
/*
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/ny-wokyrg1017,0,3904839.story?coll=ny-leadworldnews-headlines
Police drawings based on her description of the abductors show two men and a woman of indeterminate ethnic origin. Metzger told officials they were European. */
Interesting speculation from someone who has been following this case: Jill is holed up at home, dictating to the USAF what her terms are. She wants a general discharge. She will admit that she made up the kidnapping story, but it’s because she was so traumatized and disoriented after the horrific events. She wants the AF to deal with this quietly, or she’ll go public with a sob story about being raped by an American Marine, having nowhere to turn, not wanting to ruin her brilliant career, having to seek out her own abortion (the shame! the trauma!), going crazy in the process.
I re-looked at the interview with Greta Von Susteren, the one with Josh and his daddy AFTER Jill had been recovered. (Why on earth does Josh, an adult, need his daddy to do an interview???) Note how the AF chief of OSI is very quick to put in there that “Jill was very disoriented” when she was found. The AF was already trying to put a spin on her ridiculous story.
The man who got her pregnant needs to come forward NOW and go public with it. If he doesn’t, he may be looking at rape charges soon. Jill probably wouldn’t flinch from that lie if it would get her sympathy.
johca: very very well said – very well.
ijosha: sounds good to me, but what type of smuggling?
VR: Srong sign that JM’s story is fishy – actually, it means they DON’T BELIEVE HER STORY.
Kuba: you make my head spin. vote for you? with all your u.s. bashing, even Michael Moore would never allow you to “take control”.
Disclaimer: Again, no government/military computer is being used to blog here 🙂
Deb G: That comes from Borat’s web site http://www.borat2008.com He’s inetending to become US president. He’s not bashing US, but George W. Bush. So, the November 7 congressional race has just started.
About JM: I think that General Discharge is OK.
I’m not blood-thirsty. She would have easily avoided trouble by telling different story, say she had troubles with food poisoning from mushroom salads in local cafeteria and had to do detox in nearby clinic.
She had a brain chemistry glitch. And actually, everyone forgot about her in Kyrgyzstan, except me. I’m now addicted to JM hullabaloo story from Krazystan. 🙂
DM: Are you still believing in abduction? Who’s culprit? Borat? Talebans? George Soros? Russian mob? Kyrgyz gangsters?
Kuba: Hillary Clinton or Borat? hmmmmmmmm One wants to run, one claims not running – odd
Food poisoning? Another new theory! Perhaps bad spinach made her ill and irrational with her thinking……being covered because well, we just don’t exactly know where it all stems from – perhaps the Kryg government or those Europerans is trying to poison Americans with spinach or worse, someone/group is trying to make it LOOK like the Kryg gov. did it……oh boy.
You know what? JM story reminded me of Zhang Yimou’s movie “Hero”. Except, Nameless’s story was much better.
http://crisscrossmoviereviews.wetpaint.com/page/Hero/revision/2
When it’s discovered that an assassin, simply named Nameless (Jet Li), has killed the three deadliest enemies of the king (Broken Sword, Flying Snow and Sky) he is summoned to sit one hundred paces in front of Qin, the king, and tell the story of how he over powered the assassins.
No one has sat one-hundred paces from the king in many years, we learn. And as the king learns about how Nameless killed Broken Sword, Flying Snow and Sky; we also learn how Nameless killed them with the use of flashbacks (in a sort of Akira Kurosawa “Rashomon” fashion).
The king learns that Nameless used more than just a sword to kill his enemies; he used psychology as well, like, for example, pitting the lovers Flying Snow and Sky against one another.
But as Nameless continues telling his story (and continues to move closer – he’s eventually allowed to sit ten paces away), the king begins to suspect something else is happening.
When Nameless is done telling his “version” of the story, the king then offers his own version and we watch as the king unfolds Nameless’ plot to assassinate him.
WOW, this is worth starting a new blog over! This should be illegal….amazing.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061026/ap_on_bi_ge/earns_exxon_mobil
Maybe Exxon mobile execs planned Metzger’s kidnapping to take the attention away from the profits and divert it to the JM story!
Kuba: Maybe Santa Claus abducted JM. Wanted to give her as a gift to Lance Armstrong, but she beat the poor guy up when he was trying to give her milk and cookies.
Deb G.
I never said someone was making Jill look guilty, just that someone was screwing this up. But think about it for a second. Jill told a sensational story, true or not. If an OSI big dog in Kryg didn’t believe the story and was incorrect in his/her determination, that might, just might, explain why this case has proceeded as it did. Again, maybe.
Kuba Kyrgyz,
There is only one official Borat website – http://www.borat.tv – the website you quoted looks like an unconvincing rip-off.
Also, yes I still believe there was an abduction.
I asked you a while ago how exactly you think that all the clues point to abortion. I’m still interested.
VR:
“I re-looked at the interview with Greta Von Susteren, the one with Josh and his daddy AFTER Jill had been recovered. (Why on earth does Josh, an adult, need his daddy to do an interview???)”
Posted by: VR at October 26, 2006 08:30 AM
The guy’s wife disappeared for three days, he was so upset and distraught that he was having his blood pressure monitored through the ordeal, and you’re going to criticize him for accepting his family’s support? Is it hobby of yours to criticize people? How nitpicky can you possibly get?
Sickening: Totally agree wtih you. Someone could indeed be screwing this up. Even giving false information or facts or twisted info. Could someone possibly screw up the very beginning though? The statements JM gave about the bomb, the note, the escape? Even the military quoted that. Again, it could be screwed up. I truly don’t know. Just theorizing and not insisting. It is reasons like this though that make me believe JM should speak about what really happened. She is either not talking or being hushed for a reason. Either SHE screwed up or SOMEONE screwed up – agreed.
DM: (wink) siding with you on that one too – it would be normal for hubby to be overly stressed at disappearing wife and allow family to speak. The only thing which made me think twice about that thought is: as an AF OSI Officer, he would most likely (speculating here) have the type A personality and strength to speak about his wife. Many husbands of kidnapped or rape victims speak before ever finding their wife – some even ivolved in the disappearnce itself. Now, this is one reason my abortion theory is not as strong any longer, still there, but I have allowed another portion of my brain to accept info. on another theory – could Josh actually be hushed by SOMEONE as well and who is that someone???? He is not talking either. Is it due to an abortion gone bad (which would warrant hushing for MANY reasons) or is it due to something beyond our imaginations (warrant hushing too) or did she just screw up or did Santa take her?
VR: I have to agree with your theory of crying “rape” if in fact Jill did have an abortion. Could be the reason this is staying quiet – although I am sure that if there is a “sperm donor” he has already been investigated. The great thing about the Air Force being so small is that rumors and perceptions become reality during investigations. The infamous “what goes TDY, stays TDY” rule is out the window when the FBI is involved.
One thing I continue to find interesting is that there are NO postings (that I can find) on any blog of troops who have worked for Jill coming forward and saying what a great leader she is. There are plenty of her peers, friends and family saying she was an outstanding officer – but what about the troops who worked for her? Hmmmm.
I can give Josh a break in needing Daddy around during the stress of everything – although it scares me to think our military officers need their parental figures during times of stress. What I find ODD is that Josh was ALL OVER the media when she was missing and then found…my belief is that he is not standing by his woman any longer. If he was, there would be no reason to all of a sudden hide from the media.
Oh, BTW…one of my coworkers went on her honeymoon to Jamaica the week of September 23rd. If Jill is reading this…she said it was FABULOUS! She and her hubby had SUCH a great time, the weather was perfect! She says you really missed out on a great trip. So sad.
So let me get this straight. Josh is being criticized for accepting the support of his family when for all he knew his wife could be dead. And Jill’s honesty is being questioned because of the disbelief that she could have escaped her abductors. It seems as though you’d have your military personnel be super-human, but you can’t wrap your mind around it when they are.
DM-
No, JM is being criticized for her wild story (please do not make me repeat the bomb/trance thing)and then saying that her abductors STARVED her yet she escaped when they brought her food.
Josh is not being criticized for going to the media w/his father while Jill was missing…although it is ODD that an ACTIVE military member would GO HOME to DADDY during time of stress. I do NOT recall my FATHER going home to OHIO and leaving his ACTIVE DUTY job when he had friends go missing in Vietnam. I mean, if I am active duty and have a spouse stationed in Iraq who goes missing, am I allowed to stop my active duty job and go home to my parents? This is what seems odd to me. I do not ask my military to be superhuman, simply be held to the same standards I was held when I was in the military. I could not go home to my own Fathers funeral because I was deployed. True, they let me go home as soon as I returned (for 2 weeks). Josh went home immediately. Doesn’t seem fair and HARDLY seems normal. You want me to say it? If he needs his Daddy’s support during a time of stress who do his troops go to for support? Will he take his father with him to war because he is too much of a baby to deal with stess?
Sorry but this entire family (Metzger/Mayo) seem to abuse the system and break the rules when they apply to them. Wonder if Jill would have let one of her troops go home if the same thing had happened to their spouse? Probably not. She would have “kicked their ass” for asking. Double Standards.
I’m not saying Josh was WRONG to have his Dad there, I’m saying it’s ODD. What did his DAD have to do with anything? His DAD says “Jill is the light of our lives.” (Which one did Jill marry again?) Perhaps Dad felt he himself was the better public speaker, that Josh might screw something up. I just don’t know too many 26 year old men who would want their dads to sit next to them when Greta von Susteren is interviewing them about something that happened to their wives. Most, I think, would rather have their teeth drilled without Novacaine.
If this was a bad spin job by some misled OSI agent in Kyrgyzstan or elsewhere, then where is Jill’s family? Jill may be under a gag order, but certainly her dad, sisters, friends, brothers-in-law, cousins, have the right to come forward and say “Hey, something bad really did happen to her.” Her dad did say something like that within the first few days she had returned, but he also said she hadn’t talked about her experience with him yet (“We haven’t pushed that button yet.”) Now, nothing. We on this blog are not the only ones who have made the assumption that something is fishy. EVERYONE I’ve talked to (except DM) thinks something was very strange with her story, based on the little the media has reported so far.
MM: You’re good, very very good.
oh boy – does this mean Superman really exists too!????
VR: Goes right back to what just about everyone talks about – if JM were, in fact, abducted, beaten and then escaped – this would be movie stuff, book stuff, media stuff and JM AND HER FAMILY WOULD BE TALKING…….absolutely.
VR – So a young adult man having a positive relationship with his father is odd?? Maybe most 26 year olds you know just aren’t mature enough for that. And you’re critical of Jill’s father-in-law for saying she’s the light of their lives. Do you despise Jill so much that you can’t fathom a family caring about their daughter-in-law? Or is your bitterness about family coming from personal experience?
MM: Perhaps your grievance should be with whoever made the decision to let Josh leave. If you had the opportunity to leave for your father’s funeral, I’m assuming you would have taken it. And after he was given that opportunity, was he supposed to just sit around base by himself? Was he supposed to say ‘sorry Mom and Dad, but I’m a military man now and if I go to my family while my wife is missing in a foreign country, well what will people think?’ I wasn’t aware that military personnel are required to check everything that makes them human at the door when they sign up.
Here’s another oddity which doesn’t mean anything in and of itself, but tells me a little bit about the immaturity of Josh and Jill and their unusual relationship:
During the Greta von Susteren interview with Josh and daddy AFTER Jill had been recovered, Greta asks if they’d spoken with her yet. They had NOT, and Josh makes the feeble excuse that “she is probably sedated or something”. Let’s imagine you are a newlywed and you are kidnapped, and then you are rescued; you are coherent enough to blab to the Kyrgyz police and physically OK enough to have run 35 miles; who is the first person you’re likely to call once you’re at the hospital? Your HUSBAND, of course. No, Jill called her daddy and mommy first. Josh’s daddy found out before Josh did and had to burst into the doctor’s office and tell him. You can’t tell me Josh wouldn’t have been wearing his personal cellphone 24/7, and Jill wouldn’t have known the number. Even if Jill WAS sedated in the hospital, that would mean an Ativan or a Valium to calm her nerves. It’s not like they’d have her on a propofol drip and a ventilator. She hadn’t called her husband yet, and there was time for him to travel to Greta for an interview? That doesn’t strike you as odd, DM? And again also odd that Josh, during the interview, mentioned that he’d waited 5 months to see her so he could wait another few days to talk to her. What? She was kidnapped and beaten and he didn’t feel the need to talk to her right away??? I would think most newlywed husbands would already have been on the plane to be by her side, screw the interview.
DM:
Yeah, I’m probably just screwed up by my own dysfunctional family system. We all have one. In my warped world view, a 26 year old Air Force officer is man enough and mature enough to want to stand up for himself and speak for himself, and his daddy is man enough to let him.
DM: ‘sorry Mom and Dad, but I’m a military man now and if I go to my family while my wife is missing in a foreign country, well what will people think’
No, more like this:
“Sorry Mom and Dad, but I am an Officer in the military and if I go to my family while my wife ran away after getting knocked up that would be hypocrisy on my part. You see, I would not allow my troops to leave if their spouse had faked their own abduction, so I think I should follow my own rules. Sorry, Dad, I know you love Jilly Willy and this is really hurting you.”
And the fact that VR considers this behavior ODD does not signify the he/she has a bad relationship w/ his/her own family. Actually, the opposite. It is NOT HEALTHY for an adult male or female to call their parents “Mommy” and Daddy” or to stop defending their country to run home to mom and dad during times of stress. If that were the case, we would have no military!
VRVR (is that you VR?): Whoa – shedding more light here. Great points. It is HUMAN that any husband or wife would want to be with their spouse following such a “traumatic” event, and not say I can wait a few more days to talk to her. Spouses climb buildings to see each other during traumatic events. During those interviews, they all seemed so relazed……
DM: Can I ask you WHY you support Jill so much? Do you know her? Do you know what happend over there? ARE YOU JILL? Some of your support seems a bit far fetched to me. I respect you doing so, but reality is being stretched here with the “support theories”. If you make a list of pros and cons of whether Jill is lying or telling the truth – one side of the list falls off the desk with weight from all the current oddities…..and if you take a calculator and try to figure it out – it DOES NOT ADD UP…..
I think the Metzgers are Santa Claus and elves and the Island of Misfit toys…..
If Mommy and Daddy are supporting her so much and have interviewed so much then why did they not all go to Jill in Germany to “support her”????
It seems as though you’d have your military personnel be super-human, but you can’t wrap your mind around it when they are.
Author: DM
I see no evidence of either Major Jill Metzger or Capt. Joshua Mayo being super-human or even extraordinary in anyway at anytime. I see nothing but ordinary and common before disappearance and after the reappearance of both Major Metzger and Captain Mayo. Of the period during the disappearance there was nothing extraordinary done by Captain Mayo and Major Metzger’s above and beyond daring and deeds during capture, captivity, and escape are being disputed because there is simply nothing to support her claims that is being made public through official news releases.
Athletic achievements fail to exemplify what is essential about behavior, especially the behavior ability to be heroic, honest, honorable, noble, or any other trait to be admired. Super-human lacks description of being in possessions of behavior and conduct to be admired. It can equally be descriptive of pathetic behavior and conduct that is despicable and not worthy of being pitied or forgiven. Unless inquiry and investigation results in disclosure of other facts and truths, Major Jill Metzger’s behavior and conduct certainly discredits any claim of women being more ethical than men. Her behavior and conduct might even put into question which gender is most likely to have the better mental fitness to deal with the hardships of deployment to isolated locations and in dealing with the stresses of combat.
Major Metzger accepted appointment of military commission and concurrently took an oath, made a promise to perform and discharge certain duties to the fullest possible measure possible regardless of the situation and circumstances. This is exactly why enlisted military members can not commit offense of Conduct and Behavior Not Becoming an Officer and a Gentleman. The mysterious disappearance and reappearance if investigation fails to disclose otherwise certainly demonstrates Major Jill Metzger probably if not certainly-so lacks super-human qualities. There is strong probability she never possessed the expected moral competence needed to be a commissioned officer. The event also puts into question that at sometime she lost, presuming it was possessed in the first place, the mental and emotional fitness to perform military duties.
She certainly lacks any commitment to such sense of military duties such as death before dishonor. But then it appears she also lacks the courage to be honest and truthful, traits needed to be a decent person others can trust. Super-human-I don’t think so–I don’t believe so.
Now please explain why you believe Josh is super-human. From my perspective he at most was nothing more than a bystander who perhaps has an easily fooled sense of trust or has a bad sense of character. Yes-he deserves sympathy, compassion and perhaps pity, but I see nothing indicating being super-human.
DM: When the story has the ring of truth, I am completely in awe. My personal hero is COL Rhonda Cornum, the Army Flight Surgeon who was captured during the first Gulf War. I believed her story the minute I heard it. I did not have trouble wrapping my mind around her stoicism, bravery, determination, and the straight-forward eloquence in which she described her ordeal. She epitomizes the strength and moral competency of women officers for me. The difference is SHE TOLD HER STORY AND IT WAS BELIEVABLE. She didn’t say “Well, there’s an investigation going on so I’m not supposed to talk.” She didn’t hole up in her parents’ house afterwards for a month and a half. Her husband, an Air Force Flight Surgeon, didn’t appear on TV with his daddy while she was being evacuated: he was at her side immediately and he spoke for himself. I can understand that not every woman officer is going to have the intestinal fortitude of COL Cornum; but when every alarm bell in my brain goes off at the stinky story Jill told and at the subsequent behaviors of her “supporters”, when her own Wing Commander offers nothing in her defense, she’s not getting my vote for Officer of the Quarter.
Johca, I didn’t say anything about Josh being super-human. On the contrary he is being criticized for accepting the support of his father, as if this is some sign of weakness, which it is not, regardless of how disdainful VR and MM are about it.
Deb-G,
You claimed today that your were not using a USG computer during normal duty hours.
If that is true then you must be using your cigarette break to run over to the Library or ed center to post your day in-day-out comments on this blog?
You could be on TDY in another time zone and running off to an internet cafe to blog but I think that is doubtful.
Please explain to all military here how you parse your story with selected lies to cover your integrity violations.
Wasting duty hours here is just as bad as using a USG computer.
Maybe you are on welfare?
Nahh I think not.
You know just enough about the military and have made enough threats to really be an egocentric army officer.
At least JM only appears to be telling one lie, i.e her abduction.
The facts prove that YOU debG are a repeated BOLD faced liar with zero integrity.
So go hop in bed with JM where the liars belong dittums.
Posting the following TWO stories. There are many. Stuff like this does happen. Perhaps JM was reading too much. Funny how her DADDY posts: Audrey’s father, Keith Seiler, said that his daughter, who was a communication disorders and speech pathology major, was “…very focused on academics,” He described her as a “non-drinker” and “not a partier” and said she studies a lot. Imagine that, a father siding with his daughter….
Police say missing Harrah woman faked abduction
March 16, 2006 11:19 AM EST
ASSOCIATED PRESS
HARRAH, Okla. – Police say a Harrah woman who had been missing for a week staged her kidnapping to make her ex-boyfriend feel guilty.
Harrah Detective Dawn Davis says police plan to present their case to the district attorney today against 27-year-old Jennifer Van Horn. Authorities allege she filed a false police report.
Authorities found Van Horn yesterday morning crawling out of a ditch, with several cuts and bruises and seemingly incoherent.
Davis says Van Horn had been staying with a friend for the last five days and had the friend drop her off at the ditch around 3:30 yesterday morning. Davis says the cuts and bruises on Van Horn appear to be self-inflicted.
Van Horn was last seen on March 9th when she left her job at the Deer Creek Animal Hospital to walk home to Del City.
Van Horn’s sister Dorothy Tamanaha says Van Horn and her boyfriend, who also works at the animal hospital, had broken up shortly before Van Horn started walking home.
Copyright 2006 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
Audrey Seiler
Audrey SeilerAudrey Seiler is a native of Rockford, Minnesota and a former University of Wisconsin student, who faked her own abduction in Madison, Wisconsin. At 2:30 a.m. on March 27, 2004 Seiler was seen on a surveillance camera leaving her apartment without her coat and purse, leaving her apartment door open, suggesting she expected to return quickly. Police initially investigated her disappearance as an abduction. She eventually admitted that the whole thing was a hoax and as of 2005 is paying monthly restitution (scheduled to total $9,000) to the Madison Police Department, which spent an estimated $100,000 on the case. The case was investigated with the help of the FBI and garnered attention from many national news sources (Fox News[1], CNN[2], CBS[3], the National Review[4]) as well as local papers (The Badger Herald[5]) and television stations (Channel 3000[6]). The morning news broadcasts on NBC, ABC, and CBS aired a combined 98 minutes of coverage, leaving some to ponder the existence of Missing White Woman Syndrome.
Background
Audrey’s father, Keith Seiler, said that his daughter, who was a communication disorders and speech pathology major, was “…very focused on academics,” He described her as a “non-drinker” and “not a partier” and said she studies a lot.
The first “attack”- In February, Seiler reported being attacked while walking home late one weekend night on the 10 block of South Randall Street. She claimed she was struck in the head from behind and later regained consciousness behind a building on Bowen Court (2-3 blocks away). Nothing was stolen from her purse and she received treatment at a local hospital.
Events
Saturday, March 27, 2004- Seiler left her apartment at The Regent at 2:30 a.m. Friends reported her missing later that day when she did not show up at a planned function. The search started in a limited fashion at around 2 p.m. and grew in intensity.
Sunday, March 28, 2004-Chancellor Wiley and Provost Peter Spear of the University of Wisconsin-Madison sent an email to all students, faculty and staff. They asked for any information concerning Seiler’s disappearance and told of the website they’d created to assist the investigation.
Monday, March 29, 2004- Friends and family posted fliers in apartment buildings, on State Street and in other populated campus areas. K-9 Search and Rescue dogs started assisting in the search.
Tuesday, March 30, 2004- Over 100 volunteers, including many residents of her hometown, searched wooded areas of town and Police went door to door to search for clues. Police also impounded Seiler’s vehicle and checked her phone records. They did not yet know if the case was a homicide, a suicide, or a case of a runaway.
Wednesday, March 31, 2004- Seiler was found in a marshy area near the State Department of Revenue building (nearly two miles from her apartment) by a state employee out for a lunch-time stroll. Seiler allegedly told this person that she goes to the marsh to relax. While being taken to a nearby hospital she told Police that she had been held hostage by a white male with a gun and a knife. She said he was in his late 20s or early 30s and was wearing a black sweatshirt, black hat and blue jeans. Police searched the area where she was found for clues. Audrey was released from the hospital into her parents’ care later that night.
Thursday, April 1, 2004- Police declined to say how Seiler escaped or whether she had been sexually assaulted. They interviewed Seiler more extensively later in the day, but did not release any new information to the public. They added to the profile of the suspect by saying that he was between 5’11” and 6′, had chubby cheeks, a prominent chin, a small mouth with downturned corners and a long fleshy nose. Later that night in a TV interview, Madison Police Chief Nobel Wray said “Like in any other investigation, there may be inconsistencies; but we will continue to investigate.” There had been much incredulity by Madison citizens and University students concerning Seiler’s story, but this was the first acknowledgement (although guarded) by a public official that the suspect of the investigation might be Seiler.
Friday, April 2, 2004- A local TV station reported that the woman who spotted Seiler in the marsh says she might have seen her there Tuesday as well, and perhaps Monday. Seiler told Police that she left her apartment to be alone and later was abducted at knifepoint from somewhere else in Madison. This was very divergent from her initial story and investigators were nearly certain that they were dealing with a hoax. Later that day Wray said that police did not believe Seiler was abducted at all and indicated that she might be prosecuted for obstruction of justice. He said that she had allegedly been sighted in Madison during the time she was supposedly being held hostage and that she’d done web searches about local forests and marshlands and extended weather forecasts. He also confirmed that she’d been filmed buying duct tape, a knife, a rope, and cold medication: items she claimed were used as part of her abduction. The expense of the case at this point was c. $70,000 excepting manpower and expenses of FBI and volunteer searchers. NBC News reported (friends and family later confirmed) that Seiler was at a psychiatric facility.
Saturday, April 3, 2004- Amid criticism by media and others that the Madison Police Department had been fooled, department spokesman Larry Kamholz said “We can’t take the chance that there’s somebody still out there loose … Suspicion was there but we didn’t have enough to confirm that” The Seiler family hired high-profile Minneapolis attorney Randy Hopper. Hopper said that he, the family, and Seiler’s friends would not speak to the media.
April 7, 2004- Seiler returned home to Rockford, Minnesota
April 8, 2004- The Seiler family asked the media and public to respect their privacy and asked their neighbors to turn down interview requests.
April 12,2004- Police obtained a warrant to search Seiler’s cell phone and laptop. The most likely charge against her at this point was obstructing justice, a felony that could carry penalties of up to 3 1/2 years and $10,000.
April 14, 2004- Seiler was charged with two misdemeanor counts of obstructing officers, each carrying up to a 9-month jail sentence plus a fine.
April 15, 2004- Seiler’s attorney said he would seek a plea bargain.
June 10, 2004- Seiler reached a plea agreement (partial restitution of city expenses) on the two charges.
June 22, 2004 Seiler’s lawyer announced that she would enter a plea and be sentenced on July 1.
July 1, 2004- Seiler pleaded guilty to two misdemeanor counts of obstruction of justice and Judge James Martin sentenced her to three years probation and restitution fees of $9,000. The ruling also stipulated that if she gets a job earning more than $20,000 a year, she must pay $400 a month through her probation period. She also must continue to seek mental health help and perform 250 hours of community service with an organization that deals with missing children. Judge Martin also allowed the possibility for her record to be expunged. In her statement, Seiler attributed her actions to severe depression.
July 31, 2004- Madison’s Broom Street Theater started performances of “Audrey Seiler, Where Are You?” by John Sable. It is a play about the Audrey Seiler case and how it relates to popularity, the media, and the culture of the new millennium.
August 9, 2004 Madison Police records were released today revealing that police circulated the sketch of Seiler’s “abductor” even though they had a suspicion it was a hoax. The Minneapolis Star-Tribune ran a more controversial headline stating that police circulated the sketch even though they knew the abduction was a hoax.
Jody sweetie: I don’t smoke. Nice that I interest you so much. Ah, you talk about military posters or postees or whatever in here using gov. computers and blah blah blah and then you JUST CALLED MILITARY OFFICERS EGOCENTRIC. hmmmmm go away, you don’t make sense and nobody cares what you think……Nice of you to take the time to post to me though and I am glad I interest you so much. Please don’t try theorizing here though because you can’t even get anything about me right….lol sorry what I do, does not matter to you and if it does – then you have a SERIOUS PROBLEM…..
Jody: Yes, I am on welfare! Using even MORE of your tax money to come in here and post daily. Doesn’t that just piss you right off??? 🙂 I think I’ll go grab a nice bottle of evian water from the frig. – all paid for by YOUR tax money Jody! Does that piss you off more!!??? I just wish your tax money paid for anything of mine – dang – you must be a real loser not to contribute to my income….useless
Debbie dittums,
I enjoy how you avoid your violation of integrity with attacks on others.
You Fraud Waste and Abuse is as indefensible as JM’s story.
To be honest you are the only egocentric, narcissistic and obsessionistic officer I know.
Nice try again…but your are still failing and flailing when it comes to INTEGRITY.
Pitiful very Pitiful
Why he stayed away and is now staying hidden, you ask? It’s simple: she ordered him to do so. Age and rank has it’s privileges, don’t you know.
oh and Jody, pookie pie, dittums, booboo cakes: To say I (or anyone here) has zero integrity is putting YOURSELF on the bottom shelf of an old library, collecting dust, never being read, growing old with noone capturing your intelligence – because you were too far down on that poor shelf…..
You want a lie? Jill Metzger was abducted, beaten, starved and then escaoed to tell the story….
Jody snookems, pumpkin pie, noodleface: You, little hypocrit come on here and attack me – stone thrower. You are the pitiful one. You don’t know me (Thank you God). so, take your little hateful rants and shove em’ up your ass. I am glad you don’t like me though, gives you smething to do with your time…..I don’t attack others on this board. I sometimes defend my attacks. Are YOU Jill???
Jody: You’ve got some serious issues, all non warrented. Go away. I’m lurking here and learning and your bothering.
Debbie ditzs,
My reference to officers was directed specifically at YOU and no others.
In fact you are the sorriest excuse for an officer I have ever had the displeasure of knowing.
I’d bet you couldn’t pour pee from a boot, if the instructions were on the heel!
Name calling is a great way to avoid the issue of your lack of integrity as an army officer on the WWW.
Or are you, like JM hunkering down and avoiding the issue.
Come on in you pitiful remf, the water is warm.
Still waiting for your apology to all military and civilians for wasting tax payers dollars.
Debbie ditzs,
My reference to officers was directed specifically at YOU and no others.
In fact you are the sorriest excuse for an officer I have ever had the displeasure of knowing.
I’d bet you couldn’t pour pee from a boot, if the instructions were on the heel!
Name calling is a great way to avoid the issue of your lack of integrity as an army officer on the WWW.
Or are you, like JM hunkering down and avoiding the issue.
Come on in you pitiful remf, the water is warm.
Still waiting for your apology to all military and civilians for wasting tax payers dollars.
Jodah dah dah dah dumbass: Name calling? You are VERY good at it. Who died and left YOU in charge saying what someone can and cannot do? You have no integrity and don’t know the meaning of it. Avoiding the issue? There is No issue Jodah – only within yourself. I am laughing though at the thought you think you know anything about me and laughing even more that you care. Laughing even much more at the fact you posted the same thing twice because your angry inside and trying to hit that little post button, but your flabbergasted and frustrated – go have sex, you’ll feel better. Your threats are comical. I find it interesting that you take an interest in me – a cyber person no less. I’m on Welfare remember? I’m spending your tax money, not wasting it!! Again, how ironically hypocritical because you’re in here too. You say nothing about JM, I’m thinking you KNOW HER OR ARE HER….you are just critically braindead, wait, try Prozac instead of sex. You might hurt someone.
Jody: You came onto this section and started bashing. Your words are of a hypocrit and you are making yourself look foolish. How can you possibly make assumptions of someone here, regardless of what they say? Isn’t that what everyone is doing of Jill? Jill is the one who has the loss of integrity – go find another playground to play in.
Why he stayed away and is now staying hidden, you ask? It’s simple: she ordered him to do so. Age and rank has it’s privileges, don’t you know.
Author: ijosha
I don’t believe that would be considered a lawful order. To issue an order would require either being appointed to a position of command or being the superior officer in the immediate chain of command, or having a military purpose to issue another a lawful order.
Rank has its privileges, but it also has its responsibilities. Rank and grade does not necessarily bring with it command. For example chaplains hold a military commission lacking command. Professional officers of the noncombatant military (Medical professions and Chaplains) lack authority to command units of the line otherwise known as the armed combatant military.
Rank among officers of the same grade or of equivalent grades is determined by comparing dates of rank. An officer whose date of rank is earlier than the date of rank of another officer of the same or equivalent grade is senior to that officer.
Rank among officers of the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine Corps of the same grade or of equivalent grades who have the same date of rank is determined by regulations prescribed by the Secretary of Defense which shall apply uniformly among the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine Corps.
Regarding low public profile in discussing situation and circumstances in a public forum, it’s not an issue or concern of privilege of rank and grade. Due to his not being in immediate proximal physical location of when and where the event happened he has no relevance other than maybe of being more in the know of what really happened. If Major Metzger is exercising all her rights of privacy, the spouse has no access to any medical or official personal record of the military member. His direct marriage connection would also prevent him from investigating anything about or concerning his spouse. It is possible and very probable he knows no more than we do.
Johca — althought what I stated was mostly in jest, I like the point you raise: there is a possibility that Joshua Mayo may know very little more than most.
deb-g,
JM’s integrity is seriously questioned.
Deb-g’s integrity is proven to be lacking by your own comment date and times.
JM appears to have embarrassed the AF officer corp.
You DEB-g, have embarrassed the Army Officer Corps by your bashing of anyone that asks you to defend your acts of FRAUD WASTE and ABUSE.
I and a lot of other former and active military types are waiting for your explanation of your gold-bricking ways and your apology to all viewers of this blog site.
How you are able to spend so much time posting your life story and JM theories on this Blog site?
Shouldn’t you be fighting a war or something?