Notice anything missing? Something along the lines of actual proof that Rove did anything aside from simply being interviewed by Matt Cooper for a story?
Yeah, that’s it. Unless, that is, being interviewed by the media has suddenly become a crime.
In order for us to buy into what Lawrence O’Donnell is selling we must do two things:
- Believe that O’Donnell has more evidence available to him that what he’s making public now.
- Believe that Time/Newsweek sat on the fact that Rove was the Plame through all the controversy over this issue that preceeded the election, bypassing in the process some heavy duty magazine sales/ratings and the chance to derail a second Bush presidency.
Honestly, I don’t see how anyone with any common sense could believe either.
Talking to reporters is not a crime. However, what is a crime is lying to a federal grand jury.
Talking to reporters is not a crime. However, what is a crime is lying to a federal grand jury.
Unless you are the President and the question is about sex.
Being interviewed by the mainline media is a crime only, and exactly, to the extent that stupidity is a crime.
3) Have to believe that TIME and Newsweek would actually refer to Rove as a ‘government source’ and as an ‘intelligence officer’.
Either one sounds like bad sourcing to me in the first place.
I don’t see how anyone with any sense, common or otherwise, could believe O’Donnell. I think we have proof of my theory right here in the comments.
When you consider how much Rove is villified, the major media would have been shooting each other to be the first to publish this, confidentiallity be damned.
“Believe that Time/Newsweek sat on the fact…”
Perhaps they had an incentive to NOT print the story that was greater than that to INDEED pring the story.
1. O’Donnell would be much more believable if he’d remove the tinfoil hat and have the salava wiped off his chin and shirt during commercial breaks.
2. I’m afraid that Rove may have told a lie to the grand jury under the new MSM/DNC definition of “lie”. “A Republican has lied if he says something that one other person in the world honestly believes to be false.” Therefore any statement made by a Republican is automatically false and thus a lie.
3. Absolutely no way any MSM reporter would sit on a story that would sink Rove and guarantee Bush not getting elected in 2004. That would be as easy to believe as a Marine sharpshooter having Zarqawi in his sights but deciding not to pull the trigger because the sharpshooter has another plan for Zarqawi later on that is even better.
Karl Rove is like a slinky…
not really good for anything but he can still bring a smile to your face if your push him down a flight of stairs.
Al says: 3) Have to believe that TIME and Newsweek would actually refer to Rove as a ‘government source’ and as an ‘intelligence officer’.
He’s a government source, I suppose. Intelligence officer doesn’t fit the bill. Is there a link to the original article so that we can see how they originally described the source?
and thusly frapachino you miss your own point,
do you honestly think Times/Newsweek would sit on evidence Rove was the source of the leak and even risk going to jail for Karl Rove???????? when they could have used that information to its optimum advantage, during the 2004 election campaign?????
come on the Times and Newsweek only sit on bad stuff about Democratic Presidents & Presidential nomimees not Republicans please, heck they even invent bad stuff on Republicans, oh like that silly missing WMD story in the NY Times when if they had searched their own archives they would have realized their own reporters could have refute the story, that one was priceless, I guess the three reporters working on that explosive story forgot that Judith Miller and another Times reporter were embeds at the time, I’m sorry that one just makes realize how pathetic big time journalism has become, you don’t even remember your own people were on the scene or do your own archive search before writing a story…….or you conveniently forget, well Judith was trying to keep out of jail at that time…..
Rove has already said he’s quitting after Bush is gone
TIP: Whenever one encounters the bleatings of Lawrence O’ “Creepy Liar” Donnell, quit reading/listening. He has the veracity of Baghdad Bob and none of the charisma.
It really doesn’t matter what Rove said or didn’t say. If he’s a liar, we’ll never know. And if he didn’t, no one will believe him. What I’m more concerned about is why this agent was outted. “Because she stated there was no Iraqi intrerest in WMD’s (Weapons) in Niger. Excuse me, but isn’t this what Colin Powell’s presentation to the UN was all about. Also, Rove has bigger worries right now with that gay correspondent he let in (The one that asked the president baseball questions). Seems like he coming clean about a “Relationship”. Oh, Dear! Hope they are not planing on tying the knot any time soon.
I cannot for the life of me figure you guys out. Why would you even think about protecting this guy or anyone associated with this group? The economy is in the dumper, we’re at war, the price of gas is through the roof, everyone in the country hates everyone else. 6 years ago I was telling folks “you gotta give these conservative folks a chance. They’ll take a huge bite out of the deficit and get small business back on track.” Now I look out at “biggest deficit ever” and Walmart/BestBuy/Gap (i.e. Take a Hike Mom and Pop, Inc.) and wonder how people still believe these snake oil salesmen. If you aren’t already making $100+ million a year then you’re getting it in the rear from these guys. And you want to keep these guys around? Why? Because some dumbass peed on a cross? Because two dudes want to get hitched? Who gives a rats ass? How about give me back my buddy that just died on the streets Baghdad. I’ll trade you 2.. shit.. 30 gay marriages for 1 Dan Anderson.
There is no way Rove is the source. Time/NYTimes wouldn’t have sat on this and Rove wouldn’t have signed a waiver allowing reporters to testify if he had been the leak. He’s not dumb you know.
Of course Rove did it. Lawrence O’Donnell got a copy of the interview transcript from unimpeachable source Lucy Ramirez.
Of course one fact is not in dispute. Someone in the Bush White House revealed a CIA officer’s identity for crass political retaliation… And whoever the guilty party is, they would apparently rather see two journalist go to jail than to come forward and accept responsibility for their actions. Of course with this Administration, the buck always stops somewhere ——————————————————————————————————>>> over there…
Actually, it is in dispute. I’m putting money on it being the actual reporter who outed her. If Rove or whoever said Wilson was suggested by his wife, and the reporter found out her name (or it was common knowledge in DC) and what she did for a living and reported it, then the reporter well and truly stuck their foot in it.
Given that a reporter has a chance to have a member of the Bush admin branded a traitor, don’t you think they would jump at the chance?
There is no ‘there’ there, and frankly, the best they can get out of this is the endless rumours and speculation on evil doing by the Bush admin. Lets face it, Rove signed a waiver and the left are still deluding themselves that it was him.
In case no one’s seen the HuffBlo, recently – Larry’s tryin’ to butter up his roll:
Here’s a link to the TIME article:
The Newsday article doesn’t seem to be on the web, but the quote from it was taken back in 2003 by:
Just One Minute
I personally would not use ‘Government Officials’ or ‘Intelligence Officials’ to describe Rove. I’d use ‘Senior Administration Official’, ‘Party Operative’, ‘Bush confidant’….
He’s nominally ‘in’ the government, but the term ‘Government Officials’ generally applies to to non-politically appointed career feds.
I note that the Madame DeFarges on the left side of the blogosphere have already arrested, tried, and convicted Rove and set up the guillotine. I can’t imagine what would dissuade them at this point.
Yikes Baffled, you handle is well chosen.
“The economy is in the dumper, we’re at war, the price of gas is through the roof, everyone in the country hates everyone else.”
I’ll grant that gas prices are high and we are at war but other than that, I have no clue what country your living in. We have a hugely growing GDP, home sales and new construction are through the roof and home owner ship is at record highs. Average wages are going up, unemployment down, and even the lowest fifth of workers are seeing wage and productivity gains. And hate? You must be pretty young because this is the most kumbia society I’ve seen in my half century of life. Quit hanging out at DU and Kos with the haters. Breath deep of the fresh air of the right and rejoice.
Day by day, it gets better every way.
Bork for SCOTUS, tanned, rested and ready
I am sorry about your friend. Was he recently killed? Maybe your anger is understandable.
Yeah I see, pretty recent.
U.S. Army Private 1st Class Danny L. Anderson
From: Corpus Christi, Texas
Assigned To: 26th Forward Support Battalion,
2nd Brig., 3rd Infantry Div.
Based In: Fort Stewart, GA
Fatality Date: Sunday, February 27, 2005
Fatality Cause: Hostile – hostile fire
Fatality Location: Baghdad (southern part), Iraq
Again, my condolences.
“Texans always move ’em” – Robert E. Lee
Al, yes, the description of “intelligence official/government official” better fits Plame or Wilson themselves. My deduction after reading various items on the net points to a CIA officer/NSC staffer in the White House in mid 2003 (whose name is known by David Corn of The Nation), as discussed earlier in Rob’s 7/2/05 wizbang thread. (Which reminds me, I still want to go back and read your links there too.)
It’s interesting this “Plame/Leak” attack on Rove may have had earlier beginnings, described here in Kevin’s post and in subsequent comments in that thread in Feb 05:
In Feb 2005, during the Gannon/Guckert outing, Bernard Weiner’s site* had this in all caps: “Who’s The White House Gannon-Enabler?”
Even earlier, in March 2004, a leftist operative* also attacked Gannon/Guckert on this subject before Gannon/Guckert was outed. The discussion between them at FR was about Plame/Wilson and whether Gannon was the recipient of leaked classified info on Wilson’s Niger trip. Perhaps the tinfoil tent clowns planned to allege Gannon slept with Rove to get classified info! Hoping for a Profumo Affair (one of Britain’s cold war politician/prostitute/treason scandals).
*Links within the Feb 05 wizbang thread’s comments shows the Dem. operative, identified by Gannon/Guckert as Justin Raimondo, is connected to Abu Ghraib attacks and Bernard Weiner’s Crisispapers.org (a central attack strategy issuing point which applauded, possibly instigated, the efforts of Lukasiak (CBSgate), John W. Dean (Watergate/possible CIA connection(s), and more recently has been Bush attacker, and Plame/Wilson supporter), Arianna Huffington, Josh Marshall, Daniel Ellsberg, etc.
Well, BR, I find your suggestions plausible, if only for the fact that that Gannon thing was far too militant by liberals to be reasonable. It’s as if they just had to make it an issue, despite all odds, and some still try.
Obviously, they’re also — perhaps in discordant concert, albeit — trying to make for a White House impeachment thing, what with Kerry’s foolish legislation in his ongoing stupidity in the Senate, and the unless Rove is discounted (and aren’t they trying), the thing can’t advance.
It won’t advance. But about Rove, he’s far too intelligent and ethical a person (and I’m confident of that comment) to defy his own standards in some conversation with two TIME reporters.
There is a criminal investigation into who leaked Valerie Plame’s name. (fact)
Somebody did. (fact)
They haven’t come forward to admit they did. (fact)
That’s obstruction of justice (fact).
Obstruction of justice is a crime. (fact)
A crime has been committed. I don’t believe a treason charge will stick here. But we have the crime of obstruction of justice being committed by someone in the White House’s inner circle. Whether it’s Rove or not, that person should be treated at least has harshly as Martha Stewart was.
Using Lawrence O’Donnell was “Plan C” – see “memo” below.
Things move so fast here at Wizbang, this thread is probably cold already and nobody will notice if I have some fun occupying lots of space below, sort of playing piano alone in the dark:
Mypothetical Memorandum of Minutes of Meeting
[Disclaimer on completeness: only fragments of the 1001-page memo were viewed from outside the matrix. The original has much more to it, but it was shredded at Kinkos for security reasons.]
Date: Conception date of League of Nations, updated with birth of UN, and further updated every time a pro-democracy, pro-freedom, pro-sovereignty president runs for election in the US and during their administration.
Subject: Project World Slavery
(Phase 1 already accomplished – subjugation by communism and other forms of dictatorship on planet Earth, progressing well with UN and its NGOs. EU needs watching, though.)
Phase 2 – how to stymie those pesky freedom-loving Americans.
Attack Bush and his key staff, as well as US military.
Subproject Participants: Behind-the-curtain Old Europe wealth and their US minions: key anti-Bush, anti-US factions within CIA & State Dept; Soros/Hillary camp; lower-rung Dem. politicians such as Kerry, Dean, Kennedy, etc.; leftover leaders of the 60’s anti-war crowd (those who didn’t die from Gottlieb’s CIA LSD experiments); organized internet operatives; leftist professors; key UN officials; key MSM power points; key law firms.
List of Subprojects, assigned to key players:
A. Attack Bush personally
Project Hollywood (Michael Moore, Streisand, et al.)
Project AWOL/Fortunate Son (book authors/publishers; MSM in particular Reuters, AP, AFP, WP, NYT, Boston Globe, CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS and especially CBS 60 Minutes fake docs play’s dramatis personae, all the way from Viacom’s Sumner Redstone, board member Joseph Califano, CBS execs, Mapes, Michael Smith, Rather, Lukasiak, Heldt down to Burkett, and politicians like Kerry, Sen. Harkin and ex-Lt. Gov. Ben Barnes; organized internet operatives).
B. Attack Bush’s actions
Project Yellow Cake – using the forged French docs, set up Bush to claim Niger sold uranium to Iraq in a speech, but first send Wilson (ex-State Dept., husband of CIA’s Valerie Plame) to Niger for a few days, and don’t let him write a report to the White House. Once Bush mentions Niger, have Wilson come out to publicly discredit him. If this fails to bring him down, expand the project by changing its focus onto the subject of leaking classified info, point to a “WH” official, milk it for many months with reporters Miller and Cooper refusing to give up their source. Bring in the sex perversion angle by first implicating Gannon/Guckert regarding leaks, then outing him. If all else fails, have Lawrence O’Donnell go to plan C, below.
Project Leaks – Write “official” critical opinions of Bush’s policies and Bush Administration staff, then leak them to the MSM, e.g., (CIA/Paul Pillar Natl Intelligence Estimate Leak to NY Times, and CIA’s October Surprise (but aborted by Porter Goss), etc.
Project ex-CIA Whiners – Have every failed, fired, resigned ex-CIA exec, staffer, courier or toilet cleaner who at any time had some responsibility for the safety of the US pre 9/11, contact Seymour Hersh and stab Bush from behind the cloak of anonymity.
Project Downing Street Memos – Imply wrongdoing in pre-Iraq war actions, fake ’em if you have to, go for impeachment (MSM, [another?] Michael Smith in UK, plus all the usual suspects in the US, especially the OIO – Organized Internet Operatives).
C. Attack Bush’s key staff and political allies as a means to get at him, for example:
Attack Rove (any silly thing you can come up with, including sex and treason)
Attack C. Rice
Attack VP Cheney
Attack Defense Sec’y Rumsfeld
Attack incoming CIA Director Porter Goss
D. Attack US military and military leaders in particular – to weaken Bush and lower the morale of the military and Americans in general.
Project Rummy – Continue relentless attack on Sec’y of Defense Rumsfeld.
Project Torture – Setup: fake torture camp in Afghanistan (Jack Idema, rogue ex-CIA/CBS – but backfired during CBSgate, so did not air).
Project Abu Ghraib – Sustain attack over many months (Seymour Hersh, his My Lai friend/lawyer representing an Abu Ghraib defendant, Rather and Mapes at CBS, rest of MSM including fake photographs in British MSM, Justin Raimondo of Antiwar.com, Bernard Weiner of Crisispapers.org, the rest of the organized internet operatives).
Project Al Qaqaa – Push phony missing explosives story (anti-Bush faction in CIA with UN’s El Baradei, MSM)
Project Get Generals Fired – Use Abu Ghraib and any other military scandal that can be set up. For example, attack Gen. Boykin for his religious free speech (Fareed Zakaria to call for his firing – done, but unsuccessful.) [Zakaria is an Int’l editor of Newsweek and CFR member, also involved later with Newsweek’s Feb 05 “Flag in the Trashcan” Japanese and international editions, to weaken world confidence in Bush and the American economy.]
Project Kill Journalists – Claim US military policy is to kill journalists (Eason Jordan/CNN; Sgrena – Italian journalist; Linda Foley – Newspaper Guild Pres.).
Project Gitmo – Claim Gitmo Torture (MSM, Newsweek “Koran in Toilet”, Dem politicians, etc.)
I’ve previously linked all these things in threads at Wizbang, but since the above Minutes of Meeting is a fictitious memo, and I’m feeling too lazy tonight to re-link everything, I’ll claim the “fake but accurate” defense 🙂
dude, when you wake from your bush administered trance could you please come back to reality. Where is unemployment down, where are average wages up? In the construction industry? Well guess what Toby, not everyone works in that industry. As for home ownership, the statistic you forgot to mention is the amount of forclosures on those homes they give to people who lose their jobs and can’t pay the mortgage. Heck, pretty soon when they lose their jobs they won’t even be able to file bankruptcy, they will just have to work 3 jobs to pay the bills. But I guess that is your idea of the country doing well! WTFU man. Clear the brainwashing out of your head and get a clue about what is really going on.
Joe Mama, Nice comeback. 😉 You present not a single fact in evidence, no arguments, just assertions and attacks. Truly trollish. Next time use all CAPS AND EXCLAMATION POINTS!!!!!!!
Bork for SCOTUS! Tanned, rested and ready