Frederick Williams last words as he was carried into the Gwinnett County jail were, “Don’t kill me, man. Don’t kill me.” It turned out to be an unheeded plea – minutes later he was dead after receiving 5 direct stuns from a Taser gun in the span of 60 seconds. From Atlanta’s NBC affiliate WXIA:
A Gwinnett County grand jury had decided not to pursue charges in the Taser gun-related death of an inmate at the county jail.
Inmate Frederick Williams died last year after Gwinnett deputies used a Taser gun to subdue him.
Williams’ widow, Yanga Williams, said he was in a rage when she called officers to her home last May. She says her husband’s violent behavior was due to his failure to take medication for epilepsy.
District Attorney Danny Porter provided details of the investigations to a grand jury and that grand jury decided not to pursue an investigation of their own. They, however, chose not to view the videotape taken at the jail.
“They were aware of the tape and the disturbing aspects of it, but chose not to view it,” Porter said. “They chose not to see it and chose not to go any farther. For all intents and purposes, this ends my case,” he said.Before sending the case to the grand jury the DA declined to prosecute any of the deputies involved in the incident.
Is this a tragic accident or criminal (or civil) negligence? Watch the video for yourselves [Windows Media] and see if you think the application of 5 direct tasers shots to the chest was an appropriate level of force. Be sure to listen for the line, “Do you want another one?” from one of the deputies, which might change your mind if you were initially inclined to give deputies the benefit of the doubt.
Additional reporting on the story available from the Atlanta Journal Constitution (registration required).
Hmmm.
This is definitely a case of premeditated murder. The deputies must be prosecuted along with the DA Porter. It’s pretty obvious Porter didn’t want to prosecute so he must have set things up so he wouldn’t have to.
This is unacceptable.
Wow. I almost always give the cops the benefit of the doubt. In fact I barely believe 99 and 44/100ths of the brutality charges we hear about…but that wasn’t necessary. Unless there is some extraordinary circumstances to which we aren’t yet privy, that looks like brutality degenerated into murder.
Premeditated murder? Are you kidding me? You actually think the deputies planned on killing that man? Manslaughter, maybe, assuming someone can demonstrate the taser was responsible. Having been i n this situation before, I wonder what should have been done. Leave him in the cell with hand and legs cuffed? And if he never calms down? At what point do you have the responsiblity of removing the restraints? If you think one guy can not seriously injure himself and a number of officers if he just doesnt care, then your wrong.
Hmmm…
My pro cop bias leads me to believe that 11 deputies properly restrained a violent arestee, based on the video shown.
I’m particuarly intrigued by the fact that the widow considering a civil suit was the very one who called the cops asking for assistance with her out-of-control husband.
I’d be interested in seeing the whole video from beginning to end without the news channel edits. I’m willing to reverse my initial impressions if the raw, unedited footage gives evidence to support the widow’s claim.
Conclusion? It’s too early to tell. Without seeing the full, unedited video, I think the TV station does a decent job covering the facts of the story without being too sensational. The footage in question is shocking and tragic, but I remain unconvinced that it’s criminal. As the anchorman said, “Obviously a lot more on this story…”
Kevin, I don’t want to watch the video. If you get hit by one taser or an electrical current or even those medical thing-a-ma-jigs that are supposed to help pain and it’s in the wrong place, it can change your heart rhythm and even your brain stimuli but mostly it will change without question your heart rhythm. That’s why they should be used on the lowest possible power and used very little. Five people with tasers is instant death; the heart can’t beat. WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO LEARN THIS? This is not right. Everyone of them should be charged with manslaughter and assault and pay their price for killing this man. No doubts here.
Cindy
And upon rereading my published comment, I appologize for the “shocking” pun. Purely unintentional. I’m serious.
Murder? I don’t think so.
Negligent? Hells yeah.
Ok, first off, the dude was violent due to the fact he was not taking his medication for his Epilepsy. I know someone who gets violent seizures, there is no malice in their violent actions. It is not something they can control.
I did not see a doctor or a medic there, which there should have been considering the man was a known epileptic.
Did the Sherrifs do anything wrong with the Taser? I don’t think so. Were they negligent in the handling of a violent epileptic? I think they were. In this manner they are responsible for this mans death. That would be Negligent Homicide. They should be held responsible for their actions.
Unless there is more facts to this story that I am unfamiliar with, that’s how I feel on this subject.
The widow called the police for assistance in restraining a man in a violent seziure(from my understanding). Simple fact was she wanted to help her husband, now he’s dead.
My goodness! Who knew there were so many forensic pathologists and use of force experts on this blog. They can’t even determine cause of death yet you are willing to blame the deputies for it. Are you arguing that the written policies of the sheriff’s office in the proper use of the taser are defective? How? Or, that they were not followed? Again, how were they not followed? Are any of you even familar with the proper use of a taser and when it maybe used by law enforcement? Can you people be any more biased towards police officers?
I am sorry, but there is no way I could watch that. No way. It seems wrong on the surface for sure. But then I wasn’t one dealing with an out of control person.
I can see both sides. But just from what you wrote, it seems they used too much force.
“Do you want another one?” from one of the deputies, which might change your mind if you were initially inclined to give deputies the benefit of the doubt.
Why would it? All it indicates is that the deputy told him that if he continued to resist, he would use the taser on him again.
His wife stated that “her husband’s violent behavior was due to his failure to take medication for epilepsy.”
What does that mean? Note: she does not say, he didn’t take his meds, he had a seizure, and now he’s disoriented and combative. If that were the case, why not call an ambulance so he could be sedated, taken to a hospital, and given his anti-seizure medications? Now, why wd she call the police instead? You don’t even know what, if anything, she told the police. If she did tell them he had a seizure, why wouldn’t the police take him to the hospital instead of jail? Oh, I get it! Because police officers just like to have knock down drag out fights and get hurt and better yet, they like to kill people for the hell of it. What was I thinking!
As far as being negligent because there was not medical personnel there:
You are assuming they knew he was epileptic
You are assuming that due to being an epileptic that he needed medical personnel.
You are assuming that his combativeness was due to his epilepsy.
You are assuming a doctor is going to get near him when he is combative. They won’t – they will wait until he is restrained.
You are assuming that a jail has to have medical personnel at the jail.
You are assuming that they didn’t have a medical person present.
You are assuming that it would have made a difference.
Lastly, he died two days later, not, at the jail. The coroner testified that there was no evidence that the shocks from the taser either caused or contributed to his death.
One person says he died “minutes later”? The other says he died two days later? Which is true?
“You want it again?”
That makes me think the cops did NOT intend him harm. They wanted him to calm the hell down. He didn’t calm down, so he got it again. The use of tasers is a policy issue, and if they were used according to policy, the cops involved are blameless.
Several days ago you ran a story about an out-of-control inmate who put 3 police officers trying to subdue him into the hospital. I believe the injuries included a fractured vertebrae, fractured jaw, and blown-out eye socket. The police are damned-if-they-do and damned-if-they-dont.
The MURDER of Frederick J. Williams
Greetings. I am Melvin Johnson, a friend for 18 of Mr. Williams’ 31 years of existence, as well as Attorney (now along with 2 others) on this matter. Unfortunately, I just recently read your article regarding Mr. Williams’ tragic death. On behalf of Mr. Williams and the family and supporters, thanks for your humility and conscience regarding this 31 year old lost (and never to return) father of 4 very young children (ages 1 thru 9), husband, only child, church deacon, beloved friend, etc. Secondly, I wish to correct some statements in your article (again sorry that I am responding so late, I’ve been very busy).
(1) All evidence clearly suggest (to any objective-minded-red blooded-human) that the incident which started at the Williams’ home was a medical emergency and an eventual MURDER. From all of the 911 calls Ms. Williams did describe Mr. Williams’ threatened violent behavior, but clearly and repeatedly explained to the dispatcher that Mr. Williams had problems with his medication and this problem was causing his behavior. Even the 9 year old son repeated the same. In fact, this child’s last plea to the Dispatcher was “please bring the truck with the medicine,” not the taser guns.
(2) Although Gwinnett is refusing at this time to provide the entire 911 tape (which should include conversations between the dispatcher and all emergency authorities). I am certain that said recordings will indicate that the dispatcher communicated that Mr. Williams behavior was due to a medical problem.
(3) Even assuming arguendo that the dispatcher failed or forgot to mention the cause of Mr. Williams’ behavior to the authorities, when the first officer arrived on the scene and before he even approached the home or Mr. Williams, Ms. Williams and a deacon from the church greeted the officer and clearly explain the situation. In fact Ms. Williams and the deacon pleaded with the officer not to approach Mr. Williams but to wait for more officers, since the officer was smaller and appeared much older than Mr. Williams, Mr. Williams was not armed, had not left his property (Mr. Williams was in his garage/drive way), was not harming or threatening anyone and was only ‘talking crazy.’ The officer told Ms. Williams and the deacon to ‘back-up’ and the officer pulled out his asperton [baton] and approached Mr. Williams. This officer states in his own post-incident report that Mr. Williams was unarmed, in his drive-way and talking crazy when he approached Mr. Williams. Nevertheless, the officer approached Mr. Williams shouting commands for Mr. Williams to be quiet. When Mr. Williams (who is still ‘talking crazy’) did not comply, the officer states that he strikes Mr. Williams several times with his asperton. On either the third of fourth strike, Mr. Williams reacts and grabs the asperton. A struggle ensures over the asperton and the officer states that he “loses his balance” and falls. Not once in his report did he state that Mr. Williams intentional makes contact with him. The only contact between Mr. Williams and the officer was pursuant to the struggle over the asperton when the smaller officer falls and is injured as a result of the fall. Mr. Williams neither attacks nor even retaliate against the officer for the blows with the asperton while the officer is on the ground. In fact, Mr. Williams never even took one step towards the officer. The officer states that Mr. Williams essentially continues his ‘crazy’ speech and behavior and is pacing. The injured officer pulls away and indicates on the radio that he is down and injured. There is no further encounter between Mr. Williams and the officer. Mr. Williams reportedly continues his ‘crazy’ behavior and his pacing in and out of the house and about the drive-way. Back-up arrives (reportedly 10-15 officers) and storms at Mr. Williams who is still neither armed nor attacking nor threatening anyone.
(4) Mr. Williams is hog-tied (arms bound behind him and feet tightly bound) and is seen carried by police “like an animal” says one witness, is and place in the back of a patrol unit. Ms. Williams’, the deacon and others on the scene begged the police to please take Mr. Williams to the hospital for treatment as Mr. Williams appeared unconscious. The police respond that “this guy has injured one of our own, we will take him to the jail and deal with him, we have all of the medicine we need at the jail.” Persistent, Ms. Williams goes in the house, grabs and tenders Mr. Williams’ medications to the officers. The police refused it and repeat the foregoing. Scared from the reaction of the police at the scene, the deacon calls Mr. Williams’ pastor via cell phone and begs him to do something before “these people kill Fred.” The Pastor request to speak to an officer. The Pastor reiterates the reason for Mr. Williams’ behavior and pleas for medical attention, but he is told the same. An ambulance arrives and is seen treating the injured officer, so the family and witnesses go and plea with the ambulance for medical attention for Mr. Williams. They are turned away by police. Mr. Williams is transported to the jail. This entire incident is witnessed by Mr. Williams’ 4 very minor children. This is the last memory that they have of their daddy alive. This is the last memory we have of our husband, only child, deacon, friend, etc., alive. An officer who eventually transports Mr. Williams dead body to the hospital tells the medical staff (and this is documented in the medical reports) that he observed Mr. Williams foaming from his mouth and uncontrollably jerking in the patrol car at the scene at the Williams’ residence.
(5) At the jail, while still hog-tied and securely bound, Mr. Williams is tasered at least 5 times according to the autopsy reports. I say at least 5 time because not every taser attack results in an identifiable burn mark. There are mounted cameras at the jail and an officer reportedly had a hand held camcorded to record the entire ordeal. Of course, at this point, Gwinnett has refused to provide either of these recordings. Gwinnett County justifies the tasering under these conditions because according to another written report by a senior officer at the jail, Mr. Williams was reportedly thrashing and jerking his body upon arrival at the jail. Nowhere in this second report does the senior officer indicate that Mr. Williams attacks any of the officers, throws a punch, kick, bite, or anything; nonetheless, Gwinnett County officials, in the media, justifies the MURDER of this young father, husband, only child, deacon, friend, etc., because his apparent thrashing and jerking was “combative” while he is still hog-tied and securely bound. In fact, the senior officer records in his report that Mr. Williams is conscious at least for a moment, and utters his last and only words “PLEASE DON’T KILL ME.” Upon arrival of Mr. Williams’ body at the hospital, Doctors record that there were plastic instruments that were apparently used to hog-tied Mr. Williams at his house. Doctors’ examinations revealed acute with suspicion of chronic renal failure, negligible brain activity, negligible pulse, and negligible blood pressure. His hands and feet were cold and capillary refill was poor. He had no eye movements, no muscular movements and his entire body was flaccid. His pupils were dilated 6 mm and fixed. Doctors’ impression were that there was cardiac arrest, brain hemorrhage, pulmonary embolus and/or seizure. Mr. Williams reportedly lost all pulses at about 1948 hours. He had no gag response.
This account certainly seems plausible and consistent. Verified, it would certainly give major credence to Kevin’s post and should give pause to those who might want to dismiss the accusation of murder without further investigation.
What I see, however (assuming the account above is accurate) is a system of law enforcement exhibiting either poor training or poor application of training in dealing with agitated people with known medical conditions. Negligent homicide. Epilepsy, Alzheimer’s, Hypoglycemia, Schizophrenia are a few conditions that can sometimes be associated with agitated behavior that can not be reasoned with. Using pain or force in an attempt to subdue such patients is doomed to failure – the neural pathways that would work to induce submission in “normally aggressive” people will not work. Medical restraints (using medication) can be equally difficult, since the patient often sees any attempt to medicate them as a threat, and if enough drugs are delivered to sedate the patient, protection of the airway may be a priority (the patient may stop breathing).
Another dilemma in a situation like this for the police is: Here is an agitated and difficult to restrain patient – if I take him to the ER, can I protect the medical personnel from him?
Our emergency response system for most areas in this country does not include getting a doctor to the patient at the site of injury. Some countries, like Germany, have doctors that do respond to the site of a medical emergency if indicated (I think they are called Notz Arzt). The armamentarium of paramedics in our country is more limited, naturally, than what a physician can provide, but an experienced paramedic team would likely have handled this situation entirely differently at the home of the man who died. A physician would certainly have guided the handling of the situation differently. Tasers and batons would not have been likely intruments suggested by either team.
I’ve worked in ER’s and the field where patients have attacked me with broken bottles, furniture and their bare hands. Never had to use more than a few burly cops (tactical application of force initiated in a non-threatening way) to hold them down long enough to zap them once with a syringe. Though this guy was big, he had no weapons and did not attack until he was attacked. I just can’t believe he was handled comptently if the description above is anywhere near accurate.
I am not a lawyer. If the definition of murder requires the intent to take life, this appears to not be murder. Nothing I saw makes me think that was the officers intent.
This appears to be a tragedy born of several mistakes by people whose mistakes may bear horrible consequences. If Mr. Johnson is correct, the first policeman on the scene set this nightmare in motion by striking a harmless man acting crazy.
When fellow police officers hear that an officer is down, they no doubt operate on the basis that there is now a deadly serious threat. Another error.
Where was an emergency medical team asserting its authority? Another error.
Did they have to repeatedly taser a bound man? Would it not be wiser to simply monitor his condition until medical authority arrived? It appears to be another error.
I would want this case prosecuted as, minimally, a wake-up call to the authorities. Also, the consequences of the police’s actions were so severe that they deserve a public airing and fact-finding to ensure justice.
My initial impression of the tape is that it is too unclear to garner any facts not already presented in the story. Most of the time, the bodies of the policemen are blocking the camera.
The fact that death occurred a full two days after the incident certainly complicates the situation. Calling it “murder” is a big stretch IMHO. I am leaning toward negligence or maybe even manslaughter if the implications of the attorney’s story turn out to be true. At the very least, it does appear that the officers should have been more careful, given the facts.
It is too easy to become jaded from police work and constantly hearing stories from people, about 75 percent of which is bull. They appear to have too readily discounted the statements of those involved.
The implication of the attorney’s account is that the officers were hellbent on retaliation after receiving an “officer down” call. This is not at all hard to believe. More facts are needed to make a determination.
The widow casts a believable figure. Unlike those one often sees on TV, screaming at the top of their lungs about “racism” or some other such nonsense, she calmly states what she believes. This makes a much better impression.
I too am very sympathetic towards police officers, but this looks very bad.
Death by overt negligence…is murder.
There are too many erroneous, ignorant, and down right crazy statements being made to even attempt to refute them all. I am an attorney. I once worked for a very large city in their police litigation unit. It’s not a criminal case and I doubt the family would win a civil suit. You have that pesky problem of causation. The medical examiner testified that there is no evidence that the taser caused a cardiac arrest. There is no evidence that he was denied medical care once he did arrest.
Death by overt negligence…is murder.
Really? Do you have authority for that, i.e., the Ga. penal code and case law? Or, are you just making it up?
I guess any police actions short of perfection are negligence, or murder, to some people. The man was combative, for whatever reason, and wouldn’t stop even though he was in the custody of a large number of armed policemen in a jailhouse. What would he have done to medical personnel? As a former EMT, I can tell you people like that don’t get medical treatment until they are subdued. It’s a tragic situation, but getting litigious about it, or calling those who disagree with you something other than “objective-minded-red blooded-human”s, is adding insult to injury.
If he died two days later, it is unlikely the tasering did it. If someone croaks as a direct result of being roughed up and tasered, they generally croak on the spot.
If someone is violent with eleven police deputies, he is going to take a thumping. While police are often arrogant, vicious and brutal, this kind of incident is not their fault. If someone is violent with me, I am going to beat the crap out of him, not knowing or caring that he failed to take his medication or that he has a dicky heart. Police act the same. Doesn’t everyone?
Mr. Johnson,
Please give my heartfelt sorrow to this man’s wife and children. Also to you as his friend.
This is truly tragic.
Rightwingsparkle
Here’s the Amnesty International version:
Frederick Jerome Williams, aged 31, died in Gwinnett County Jail, Georgia, in June 2004, after being shocked with a taser while being strapped into a restraint chair. According to media reports, police went to his home after receiving a call from Williams’ nine-year-old son saying that his dad was “talking crazy” and not taking his epilepsy medication. The boy reportedly asked for an ambulance “because my dad is saying all sorts of stuff and he is hitting my mom with a belt”. When police arrived, Williams called the officer “the devil” and grabbed the officer’s baton and threw it at him. Despite the son’s request for a “hospital truck”, police arrested him and took him to jail. He was reportedly struck twice with a taser while being strapped into a restraint chair and was noticed to have stopped breathing seconds later. He died later in hospital.
The autopsy is reported to have found that Williams had died of brain damage caused by “lack of oxygen and/or blood to the brain” from a heart attack triggered during the altercation. The forensic examiners reported that “There is no evidence the Taser directly caused or contributed to his death”, but were unable to determine the reasons for the heart attack.
Not taking seizure medication does not cause one to become violent. If someone has a seizure, they may become combative and disoriented afterwards. By combative, they are prone and flailing about. Neither having a seizure or not taking your seizure medication causes one to become violent. It does not cause you to walk around beating your wife with a belt. This guy was involved in a domestic violence incident. When the cops arrived, he knew he was going to jail and fought the cops.
There is no evidence that Williams was hog-tied. By the attorney’s own definition he was not hog-tied. Handcuffs and leg restraints (they used plastic -cuffs) is not hog-tied. So, why do you think the attorney chose to use that word?
Just what exactly is the reason this guy didn’t take his required epilepsy drugs? Seems to me like he should’ve done what he was supposed to do, anything that happens as a result of his willful negligence is his own fault.
Those cops could’ve been protecting innocent people instead of dealing with this idiots self-imposed situation
This case stinks, tasers are supposed to be non-lethal.
This case stinks, tasers are supposed to be non-lethal.
Your proof that in this case it was lethal is?
Forum calls for Taser curbs
A coalition of activist groups put Tasers under the microscope at a Sunday night community forum at the Gwinnett Justice and Administration Center.
The sparsely attended forum was sponsored by the Southern Christian Leadership Conference in a commemoration of the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.’s battle against violence in all its forms. Today is the 37th anniversary of King’s assassination.
The two-hour meeting, which began at 6, was spurred by the deaths of two men at the Gwinnett County jail. One had been shocked three
times; the other, five.
Groups on hand included the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, NAACP, American Civil Liberties Union, Concerned Black Clergy, Rainbow/PUSH Coalition, Georgia Association of Black Elected Officials and Amnesty International.
Gwinnett District Attorney Danny Porter, Sheriff Butch Conway and police Chief Charles Walters had been invited, said the Rev. John Stewart, the moderator, but all declined because of possible
litigation.
The groups have called for a moratorium on use of the devices until definitive independent research has been performed. They also called for more training by law enforcement agencies and written policies akin to those on use of lethal force.
“Every [law enforcement] department has a clear policy on the use of deadly force,” said panelist Fay Coffield, a retired Atlanta Police Department sergeant who now works as a private investigator.
“There are no uniform policies on Tasers.”
The NAACP’s Gwinnett branch distributed a draft resolution calling on the County Commission to suspend any Taser use until research is completed.
Barring that suspension, the resolution requests that only trained supervisors be allowed to use Tasers. That is the policy in DeKalb County, panelists said, where there have been no Taser deaths.
Policies differ
Use of the controversial devices has sparked a national debate on whether they constitute use of excessive force.
Some agencies, such as the Macon Police and Forsyth County Sheriff’s departments, have stopped using Tasers.
Gwinnett Sheriff Butch Conway, on the other hand, has said he thinks they’re one of the best available alternatives to lethal force.
State Rep. Tyrone Brooks (D-Atlanta) told the audience he sponsored legislation on the use of Tasers, stun guns and other electroshock
devices that failed to make it through this session, but will be resurrected next year.
“We must hear from victims and their families,” Brooks said.
The SCLC wants to see a national policy on Taser use, said SCLC General Counsel Dexter Wimbish, another panelist.
More than 7,000 law enforcement agencies worldwide use the devices, according to manufacturer Taser International.
Tasers use what is supposed to be a nonlethal pulsating electric shock to immobilize a person — a shock that according to some is lower than that applied by the defibrillators used by medical
emergency services.
The SCLC says the devices have been linked to 86 deaths nationwide since 1999. A study released by Amnesty International on Friday put the number at 103 in the United States and Canada during the past four years.
In particular, Amnesty International claims Tasers can be deadly to those with pre-existing heart conditions.
Representatives of Taser International maintain that no death has been directly caused by its product.
Deputies cleared
In the past two years, five people in Georgia have died after being shocked with Tasers by law officers. Two Gwinnett County inmates died in a nine-month period after scuffles with deputies and Taser shocks.
Ray Charles Austin, 25, died in September 2003 after he was stunned three times, given psychotropic drugs, punched and placed in a restraint chair.
Last May, Frederick Williams, 31, died after he was shocked five times in a tussle with five deputies.
Both men died of heart attacks, according to the county medical examiner.
All the deputies were cleared of wrongdoing, though District Attorney Danny Porter said last week he was considering filing criminal charges in the Williams case and was still investigating.
“The family is confused about the status of the case,” said Melvin Johnson, the Williams family’s attorney, who attended the forum with Williams’ widow, Yanga Williams.
Williams said she thought the forum was beneficial, though she said she would like to have seen it better attended. About 20 people in
addition to the panelists attended the forum.
Having more proponents of the devices’ use on hand would be helpful, Johnson said.
Audience member Todd Pell, 34, of Buford drew gasps from the crowd when he asserted that the Gwinnett Sheriff’s Department has used electric shock — first used by the Nazis in 1938, he said —
as a method of torture since 1999.
“The practice goes on,” Pell said. “Nothing’s changed, and until there’s an investigation into the murder of this individual [Williams], nothing will.”
http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/gwinnett/0405/04taser.html
One thing that troubles me is that they say the deputy used the taser five times on his chest. I’m no doctor, and I’m no expert on tasers, but using electrical shocks that close to the heart can NOT be a good idea. The heart is probably the most sensitive part of the body to electrical shock, and the way the electric chair works (as I understand it) is to get the electric charge to go through the heart. There must have been somewhere else on this guy’s body they could have zapped him that wasn’t right on top of his heart.
J.
Dear Forum:
If you actually read the reports instead of paraphrasing someone else’s conclusion you would see that they are citing all deaths where a taser was used – not all deaths as a result of the use of a taser. The cause of death on almost all of them was the ingestion of huge quantities of cocaine and/or methamphetamine. Go figure.
I’m no doctor, and I’m no expert on tasers,
That’s for sure.
but using electrical shocks that close to the heart can NOT be a good idea.
Tasers have been around for over 20 years. The protocol, which was undoubtedly based on extensive studies, is to aim for the centre of the chest. Therefore, I would say it IS a good idea.
One thing that troubles me …
The heart is not the most sensitive part of the body to electric shocks – that would be the brain.
The electric chair works by passing a current from a contact point on top of the prisoner’s shaved head, through the brain and to a contact normally placed around the prisoner’s leg or ankle. The Voltage is much lower than a taser. but the current is much thousands of times higher. About the only similarity between a taser and an electric chair is that they both use electricity to function.
Police officers receive training on the effective use of tasers and without knowing what they are taught, I’d be unwilling to make a claim that shocking the guy in the chest is improper or specially dangerous. My understanding is that the biggest danger from being tasered is the loss of motor functions which can cause you to fall and hurt yourself.
If the taser caused the death (which it does not appear to have done) the death would have been immediate. The news story said the guy died two days later. That long of a period puts the lie to the idea that the taser caused the death.
And finally, there are consequences to resisting arrest – this person suffered one. I do not support killing someone just because they resist arrest, but I do not put a lot of blame on policemen who are just trying to get control of the situation before a policeman is injured or killed.
And finally, as was stated previously, there is no evidence that the taser caused the death of this person. So the police didn’t kill him. I suggest an autopsy will be conducted and will identify the real cause of death.
Here’s a good reason just to say no: Link
His death was unfortunate but, to be blunt, when will
violent criminals learn to not resist arrest?
This guy didn’t deserve to die but he certainly
deserved the tasers.
What kind of man continues to struggle after one Tazer hit? Somehow I don’t think lack of drugs was the problem. I’d like to see what the doctor’s have to say were in his system prior to his death. Bets anyone?
Considering the fact that over 100 people have died after being hit with tasers, the taser should have been banned YEARS ago.
Instead, police departments are trying to defend this torture device, because to them it is fun to sit there and shock people silly.
Until they ban these things, they are just like an electric chair, without the chair.
They shock your heart, and stop it. PERIOD.
There are no conclusive medical studies that prove tasers as being safe, so they should be banned, without question.
Violent criminal?
Fredrick Williams was an epileptic in the midst of a seizure. The autopsy indicated he had no drugs in his system at all. He had appaently stopped taking his prescription medication as well.
And no, he did not “die” at the jail. He was kept alive on life support until even that failed to sustain him. However, he was “brain dead” immediately following his Taser “electrocution” at the jail.
There were 11 trained officers and one unarmed man still in restraints, when he received the five shots to the chest. Do you really think he deserved to die?
This was the second such Taser death at the jail within 8 months. The former involved an unarmed inmate (pre-trial detainee) and according to newspaper reports, 12 to 20 deputies.
If Tasers are intended to be an alternative to using a firearm, it’s a good thing. However, since no firearms are permitted inside the jail….
Considering the fact that over 100 people have died after being hit with tasers, the taser should have been banned YEARS ago.
Bull. Again, you are referring to a stat which includes any death where a taser was employed – NOT where the taser was the cause of death. The vast majority of the deaths were the result of cocaine and meth overdoses.
Rule of thumb: If you are out of shape, fat, have a pre-existing heart or other medical condition – don’t consume massive quantities of meth and cocaine and fight the cops.
They shock your heart, and stop it. PERIOD.
Really? Where’s your proof? And part of the training for law enforcement is that they have a taser used on them. So, why aren’t they dead? PERIOD.
There are no conclusive medical studies that prove tasers as being safe, so they should be banned, without question.
You mean that there are no studies that prove they are unsafe.
Violent criminal?
Yes, violent criminal. Last time I checked beating your wife with a belt is both violent and criminal. Or, are you okay with that?
Fredrick Williams was an epileptic in the midst of a seizure. The autopsy indicated he had no drugs in his system at all. He had appaently stopped taking his prescription medication as well.
Note well: No one has said that he was in the midst or that he even experienced a seizure. Not his wife . Not his wife’s alleged attorney.
Are you arguing that because one is epileptic they are violent unless medicated? Got proof? We won’t even get into the fact the medication was to raise his seizure threshold – it does not make one nonviolent. The lack of it does not make one violent. I thought we had come a long way from the prejudice and ignorance that epileptics were once subjected to. Judging from your posts and others, — obviously not.
And no, he did not “die” at the jail. He was kept alive on life support until even that failed to sustain him. However, he was “brain dead” immediately following his Taser “electrocution” at the jail.
He had a cardiac arrest while in custody and was transported to a hospital where he died 2 days later. There is no evidence that the taser was the cause or a contributing factor to his death. That is all we know.
There were 11 trained officers and one unarmed man still in restraints, when he received the five shots to the chest. Do you really think he deserved to die?
No, I don’t think he deserved to die. Do you really think you have to lie and make up facts as to what occurred and his cause of death?
What is your point with the number 11? If five people could not restrain him, neither would eleven. They were in the midst of removing the handcuffs to put him in a restraint chair. Why? Because it is risky to leave someone who is fighting just laying on the ground with handcuffs and leg restraints, because one, they can still hurt themselves, and two, positional asphyxia. Damned if they do. Damned if they don’t.
This was the second such Taser death at the jail within 8 months. The former involved an unarmed inmate (pre-trial detainee) and according to newspaper reports, 12 to 20 deputies.
You mean the guy in custody on a parole violation? Who fought the deputies and bit off part of a deputy’s ear? He was tapered x3, restrained, and given Halodol. Yes, he died, but again, the medical examiner ruled that he could not determine what caused his heart failure.
Oh, and I like how you refer to him as an”unarmed pretrial detainee.” He had no right to a trial. Just a hearing before he was shipped back to prison. And though unarmed, hardly not dangerous. Were you deliberately trying to mislead people?
And again, explain how 12 to 20 deputies (I assume you mean everyone who was working in the jail) are more effective than a lower number? Or, are you just throwing out irrelevant numbers for effect?
If Tasers are intended to be an alternative to using a firearm, it’s a good thing. However, since no firearms are permitted inside the jail….
So, you are suggesting they just be beaten into submission? You don’t think that’s risky? Or, should they just be cuffed and left lying in a cell so they can beat their head against the floor? Or, should they just be allowed to lie in their cell and because of the cuffs be allowed to aphyixiate? What’s your pleasure?
As correctly stated above: in EVERY SINGLE case of someone dying after being hit with a TASER it has been found that an underlying medical condition was actually the cause of death, not the TASER. That is a FACT, not an opinion.
“Considering the fact that over 100 people have died after being hit with tasers, the taser should have been banned YEARS ago.”
Do any of you people know how many prisioners die each year following an apprehension when traditional methods (night stick, pepper spray/mace, rubber bullet, hand gun) are used? Thousands, that’s how many.
Someone earlier in this blog stated that they thought TASERS were supposed to be “non-leathal” and went on to say how TASERS should be immediately banned. That person is typical of the kind that loves to jump into a discussion they know nothing about. TASERS are not touted as “non-leathal” they are advertised as a “less-leathal” alternative to traditional law enforcement weapons. Tell, me what would happen if you got shot with a handgun in the chest just once?
This is really the problem with the public’s uneducated views on TASER. They believe that TASERS are non-leathal and when they then hear of someone getting injured from one, the go ballistic.
The FACTS are that the use of TASER weapons as opposed to other weapons has reduced officer AND suspect injuries dramatically. This is a verifiable FACT. That’s why police agencies all over are buying and using them.
Someone else in this blog posted Amnesty International’s “version” of the events in this case. If AI had their way, there would be no weapons at all and everyone would be walking around with flowers sticking out of their ears. That may be a nice vision, but it isn’t anywhere close to reality. Much like their “version” of events here. If you know anything about AI’s history with TASER, you know that they have been against TASER since the beginning.
“Instead, police departments are trying to defend this torture device, because to them it is fun to sit there and shock people silly.”
Yeah, I’m sure that’s it Bill. You seem to have a real solid grasp on the facts.
“Until they ban these things, they are just like an electric chair, without the chair.”
Except for the fact that over 100,000 people have been hit with TASERS and are walking around just fine today and exactly ZERO people who have been electricuted are walking around today.
“They shock your heart, and stop it. PERIOD.”
Hmmm, so let’s get rid of all those pesky CPR shock devices as well because we know that any kind of shock to the hear must be fatal, right?
“There are no conclusive medical studies that prove tasers as being safe, so they should be banned, without question.”
Really? What about the studies the the DOD and the UK Home Office have done?
I find it interesting that no one wants to talk about the THOUSDANDS of documented cases where TASERS have been used to save the lives of suspects, officer and suvillians.
There are a couple of opening points I’ll disclose. First, I don’t particularly trust cops. I’m a patchholder in a “13” motorcycle club, and I’ve seen firsthand the attitudes and presumptions of which policemen are capable, just based upon what I’m wearing. Secondly, I do think this man’s death is a tragedy (but don’t read too much into that word.)
The utterance of “don’t kill me” indicated that Mr. Williams perceived a threat. If he could do that, one would generally assume that he had sufficient mental faculty to stop thrashing about and fighting. Further, this subject wasn’t having an epileptic seizure–seizures that involve the entire body bring about random thrashing about, and the patient stops breathing until the seizure ends. The greatest danger is that the patient will descend into a condition of status epilepticus, in which the seizure doesn’t end until the oxygen-deprived brain stops functioning.
Next, the assertion that the tazer “stops the heart” is absurd. It works by spreading a high-voltage, low-amperage shock throughout the nervous system, and essentially causing an “overload” to the pain receptor in the brain. In other words, it hurts like hell, but doesn’t injure. In the case of a cardiac defibrillator (the “heart-start” machine, the voltage is much lower (only 12VDC), but the amperage/energy is very high. That’s why it penetrates to the electrical center of the heart in an effort to “stop” and thereby “reset” it. In short, anyone equating the tazer to the electric chair simply displays their ignorance of both electrical theory and physiology. Additionally, several “recreational” drugs give the user superhuman strength because they chemically block pain receptors–which would keep a tazer shock from having much effect.
I do feel for the widow and the children in this case, but there’s simply no evidence that this man’s death was a result of epilepsy or of tazer shocks. More likely is the possibility that his cardiac arrest was the result of a massive heart attack stemming from his exertion while resisting arrest.
I suppose a high-tech solution would be a super-strong padded bubble into which a person like this could be dropped, then left to bounce around until he wore out. But until something like that comes into use, I think these guys were doing the best they could.
Scott:
I posted AI’s version because it contained additional facts not mentioned in other accounts, i.e., that Williams was beating his wife with a belt.
Their account supports the fact that this was a domestic violence call. The fact that Williams had the wherefore all to take a belt to his wife, indicates that he did not just have a seizure. And since they are hardly pro-police, it gives those facts credibility.
And part of the training for law enforcement is that they have a taser used on them. So, why aren’t they dead? PERIOD.
TASERS have two settings. Police who are subject to it in training, are given the lesser (1/2) jolt. And, that’s one (1) shock — not 5 in a minute.
Last time I checked beating your wife with a belt is both violent and criminal. Or, are you okay with that?
His wife has repeatedly stated she was NOT beaten. Why bend the facts?
No one has said that he was in the midst or that he even experienced a seizure. Not his wife. Not his wife’s alleged attorney.
Guess you missed that part. For reference, following a seizure, the transition back to a person’s normal state, the “post-ictal period” (an ictus is a seizure) may last from several minutes to hours, depending on several factors including which part(s) of the brain were affected by the seizure and whether the individual had been taking their anti-seizure medication. Symptoms that occur during the post-ictal period include confusion, shaking, stiffening, tremors, twiching movements, and convulsion. (No, I was not there, so I can’t say for certain, and yes, I have a medical degree).
Are you arguing that because one is epileptic they are violent unless medicated?
Do you know why some epileptics — who even take their meds religiously — wear helmets?
He had a cardiac arrest while in custody and was transported to a hospital where he died 2 days later. There is no evidence that the taser was the cause or a contributing factor to his death. That is all we know.
Many patients who contract AIDS (even by simple blood transfusion) die of various disorders — but generally not AIDS. It is AIDS, however, which was responsible for their death.
No, I don’t think he deserved to die. Do you really think you have to lie and make up facts as to what occurred and his cause of death?
Would he have died if the officers in the controlled environment of a jail NOT shocked him? I can’t say for sure. We do know, however, know the results of the five electric shocks.
What is your point with the number 11? If five people could not restrain him, neither would eleven.
If five people could not restrain an unarmed man in a controlled environment, maybe they need better training.
Damned if they do. Damned if they don’t.
I agree, however, I think the taunts on the tape from the officers speak for themself.
You mean the guy in custody on a parole violation? Who fought the deputies and bit off part of a deputy’s ear?
While it would be hard to imaginge 12 to 20 deputies kicking and punching a man already down (like the deputy who resigned the day after the death explained in the AJC), I can imagine the result of one placing his ear to close to the man’s mouth. One in that situation might believe he was at risk of being killed (in this case, he would have been right).
He was tapered x3, restrained, and given Halodol. Yes, he died, but again, the medical examiner ruled that he could not determine what caused his heart failure.
Me thinks we see a pattern here.
Oh, and I like how you refer to him as an”unarmed pretrial detainee.” He had no right to a trial.
You’re sounding more and more like Death Camp may be more your cup of tea. I thought in the US we had the right to a trial.
And again, explain how 12 to 20 deputies (I assume you mean everyone who was working in the jail) are more effective than a lower number? Or, are you just throwing out irrelevant numbers for effect?
From the October 10, 2003 AJC, Deputy Olen Harris, who resigned from the department following the death, stated “All I did was
help get the guy in the [restraint] chair and handcuff him. By the time I got there, there was 10 or 20 people in [the cellblock] and they were already dog-piled on top of the guy.” Okay, I was off by 2. It was 10 to 20 officers on top of him.
So, you are suggesting they just be beaten into submission? You don’t think that’s risky?
Once again, training. I’m not a cop. I don’t pretend to be one. I am familiar with police training. Very little in the training of a deputy (a high school diploma and a clean record is all you need), deals with confronting such situations WITHOUT violence. This facility is not a prison; it is a county jail. Could better training have saved both of these mens lives? Probably so.
Okey so i learned something new today; Taser are less-than lethal and can kill under some circumstances where the subject has used drugs or has a heart condition.
I think this was an accident, the police probably lacked the proper knowledge and training. They were probably not aware of the fact that tasers can be lethal.
Anyone ever take basic electricity/electronics/wiring?
Electricity follows the path of least resistance and the shortest path to ground.
Depending on how the TASER was used (I didn’t watch the video) two darts are fired toward the subject that remain attached to the body of the TASER via wires. They are barbed so they are not easily disloged once they meet the subject (I hear its not a very polite meeting…)
The current would follow the shortest path accross the skin resistance but definately along the skin from one electrode (dart) to another.
Some models can also be used without firing the darts- instead using electrodes embedded on the outer shell of its plastic body that are pressed against the subject.
The TASER is not some weird object that operates outside the laws of physics. It wasn’t beamed in from a Star Trek episode. Its electricity behaves the same as any other electricity.
Further up the thread someone likened the TASER to a defib/AED/cardioverter.
Note that with the defib/AED/Cardioverter the electrode pads have a greater surface area -an effort to prevent burns from thermal rise (heating) that results when the high power surge passes through a resistance (current passing through a resistor causes the resistor to heat up).
The DEFIB/AED/CARDIOVERTER electrode pads have a specific placement- one over and slightly right of the heart, the other directly below the arm pit on the side of the chest. This presents the shortest path for the electricity to travel into,through and exit from the heart. Providing the shortest path of least resistance is also important in order to prevent burns (thermal rise).
The characteristics of the electrical impulses used in the two devices are completely different.
TASER tailors the train of DC pulses from its products to produce maximum pain/effective override of voluntarily muscle control. The shape of the pulse is carefully controlled and the output power is carefully regulated. The shape of the pulse(s) is carefully shaped and controlled.
I believe I read somewhere that they claim a 25 joule peak power output.
A defib/AED/cardioverter usually starts with an output pulse that is 300 joules. It is delivered as a single wide pulse. It then takes awhile for the unit to generate and store the energy necessary for a repeat performance (if necessary).
Its probably not appropriate to characterize a TASER as a toy by comparisson but seriously- 25 joules (peak value when the battery is fresh) versus 300 as a starting power level?
One of the reasons an DEFIB/AED/CARDIOVERTER is a larger,heavier piece of equipment is that the capacitor necessary to store such a high energy pulse is large by necessity. And the battery to power the electronics must be certified able to power the unit for several uses.
TASER does use the phrase “less lethal”.
Use of force is generally described as being on a continuum- from simple presence in uniform, then verbal, open hand, closed hand, chemical irritant, and upward to more possibly lethal force.
At all times attempting to gain compliance by verbally instructing/commanding- essentially explaining to the subject what is required so the use of force can be ended or at least de escalated.
What I see as problematic in this case (as presented- I was not there) is that you have an unarmed man on his own property not threatening himself and with no one in immediate reach. You have an officer arriving who is presumably fully equipped and fit for duty. He has whatever info was provided by dispatch.
What would super deluxe best cop ever do?
Assess.
According to the reports the cop that arrived didn’t assess.
He didn’t ask “whose related to this guy? What can you tell me? He got any weapons on him? Can he get at any weapons in the garage or the house? He been drinking? He been doing any drugs today? Is he hurt? Are you hurt? Is anybody hurt? Did he hurt anybody?”
Did Mr First arriving cop maintain a safe reactionary distance?
Did he approach (keeping his hands free, open and in view and keeping his gun side away from the subject) and say “I’m here to help you, what can I help you with? Can you hear me? Whats your name?”
No reaction? Then he moves his weapon hand toward his weapon and rests it momentarily on his weapon- pretenders will notice this move and react to it.
According to the reports:
Cop number 1 arrived and identified a target. Then he engaged the enemy. Cop number 1 didn’t project a helpful, professional attitude. He demanded. He commanded. And when that didn’t work he went in impact weapon hot- not in defense of himself or another but as a show of force or possibly as an attempt to gain compliance.
Apparently this cop wanted to break a sweat. It probably would have been better not to break a sweat and to wait and use a show of numbers.
Not withstanding its hard to believe the first arriving officer didn’t want to wait for someone to cover his back. Going impact weapon hot without someone covering your back is not really a great idea since you focus forward and become unaware of the wife/cousin/brother/friend rushing you from behind in defense of their husband/cousin/brother/friend that you are now beating on with some version of a baton.
Just from an officer safety stand point it appears the first officer on the scene was inexperienced or poorly trained or both.
The point of my explaination on the TASER was that the effectiveness of it comes from the pain impulses being propagated by the nervous system that causes the incapacitation- not that electricity is coarsing through the body. The electricity travels between the darts and affects the nerves in the immediate area. Those nerves relay pain impulses to the nervous system and the signals are strong enough to overcome the impulses that normally control the voluntary muscles.
TASERS have two settings. Police who are subject to it in training, are given the lesser (1/2) jolt. And, that’s one (1) shock — not 5 in a minute.
What’s your authority as to what all police in training are subject to? How many subjects have received 5 shocks or more and did not die? Do you know? And what is your source that there is a correlation between the number of applications and injury?
His wife has repeatedly stated she was NOT beaten. Why bend the facts?
Then why did his son call 911 and say, HE IS HITTING MY MOM WITH A BELT ? Does his wife now have a motive to lie? Yes. Is it uncommon for DV victims to lie about the abuse? Who is more believable – a person with a motive to lie after the fact? Or, the son who gave an account of what was happening to 911?
And speaking of bending facts — I posted where I found mine but you didn’t post where you got your facts? Why?
“No one has said that he was in the midst or that he even experienced a seizure. Not his wife. Not his wife’s alleged attorney.”
Guess you missed that part. [snip for brevity and because it does not address the above statement.]
Guess you can’t read. Neither his wife or her alleged atty have stated he had a seizure. Nor has anyone stated that he was convulsing, twitching, shaking, etc.
Do you know why some epileptics — who even take their meds religiously — wear helmets?
Yes. Are you implying that the mere fact that someone is an epileptic makes then prone to violence towards others? Are you comparing seizures where a person has involuntary movements and injures their head with taking your belt and using it to strike your wife?
Many patients who contract AIDS (even by simple blood transfusion) die of various disorders — but generally not AIDS. It is AIDS, however, which was responsible for their death.
That’s nice. But we’re not talking about AIDS, are we? And, what they do die of can be determined by a pathologist to be related to AIDS. In other words, unlike the Williams case: There is proof.
We do know, however, know the results of the five electric shocks.
Are you claiming to know more than the M.E. who performed the autopsy? Is your degree in Psychic-medicine?
If five people could not restrain an unarmed man in a controlled environment, maybe they need better training.
Maybe, you are the one who needs better training. Your ability to misread what is written is astounding.
I agree, however, I think the taunts on the tape from the officers speak for themself.
There were no taunts.
While it would be hard to imaginge 12 to 20 deputies kicking and punching a man already down (like the deputy who resigned the day after the death explained in the AJC), I can imagine the result of one placing his ear to close to the man’s mouth. One in that situation might believe he was at risk of being killed (in this case, he would have been right).
Can you write something that makes sense? I have no idea what you are trying to say.
“He was tazered x3, restrained, and given Halodol. Yes, he died, but again, the medical examiner ruled that he could not determine what caused his heart failure.” Me thinks we see a pattern here.
Halodol kills!
You’re sounding more and more like Death Camp may be more your cup of tea. I thought in the US we had the right to a trial.
No, I’m a person who doesn’t believe in convicting cops on Psychic-Evidence. You try to make it sound like this guy hadn’t already been adjudged to be dangerous. This guy had already been to prison and was out on parole when he assaulted his roommate. He was in custody waiting for his parole violation hearing. There is no right to a trial on a parole violation. Don’t like it? Take it up with the US Constitution.
From the October 10, 2003 AJC, Deputy Olen Harris, who resigned from the department following the death, stated “All I did was help get the guy in the [restraint] chair and handcuff him. By the time I got there, there was 10 or 20 people in [the cellblock] and they were already dog-piled on top of the guy.” Okay, I was off by 2. It was 10 to 20 officers on top of him.
You didn’t answer the question. Explain how those numbers are relevant. There is a big difference between 10 guys and 20 guys. Sounds a bit like hyperbole on Harris’ part.
Oh, and I like how you quote the part that makes it look like Harris quit as a result of the incident and omit where he states his resignation was not a result of the fight. Your bias is showing – again.
Once again, training. I’m not a cop. I don’t pretend to be one. I am familiar with police training. Very little in the training of a deputy (a high school diploma and a clean record is all you need), deals with confronting such situations WITHOUT violence. This facility is not a prison; it is a county jail.
If you are not a cop or in a related field, you are not familiar with police training to offer an opinion on it. And you certainly cannot attest to what training is required at the Gwinnett Co. Sheriffs’ Dept. In both my local and county LE depts. there is a minimum requirement of two years college. However, since it is so competitive to get in, most officers have a B.A. Two I know have MBAs. And I know a half dozen with J.D.s. Training is constant.
But, it suits your purpose to portray LE as idiots.
And the whole purpose of using a taser, bean bag, net, and other types of non-lethal weapons is to AVOID violence. Of course, they are trained in how to avoid confrontation, but not when it will ultimately lead to either them or the subject getting hurt.
Could better training have saved both of these mens lives? Probably so.
Unfortunately, unlike you, the police don’t have psychic abilities and can’t always predict what is going to happen.
TASER does use the phrase “less lethal”.
As of Nov 2004, they refer to it as non-lethal.
Amazed, you did not read the arrest reports or those of any witnesses interviewed. Therefore, you have no idea what the officer who first arrived on the scene did or did not do.
And you certainly cannot attest to what training is required at the Gwinnett Co. Sheriffs’ Dept. In both my local and county LE depts. there is a minimum requirement of two years college. However, since it is so competitive to get in, most officers have a B.A. Two I know have MBAs. And I know a half dozen with J.D.s. Training is constant.
But, it suits your purpose to portray LE as idiots.
Actually, I read it from their web site:
Requirements for Deputy Sheriff I/Jailer
“High school diploma or GED equivalency. Must possess a valid driver’s license. Must be at least 20 years of age at the time application is submitted. Applicant must be a United States citizen. Must attend and successfully complete the Basic Jail Officers Training course within six months of employment date. Must be willing and able to perform rotating shift work. Must successfully pass the pre-employment process which includes written exam, background investigation, controlled voice stress analysis and oral interview.”
I have seen enough of “Taser” clips. If the person does not stop fighting, oh well! JUST STOP! Police are not nice, they don’t deal with nice people! You can’t do their job, so don’t complain how they do it. Man’s beating his wife and the nine year old says he needs medicine, how are they to know it is not PCP he’s and the kid said it wrong?
And don’t listen to the lawyers, God three of them, the poor widow won’t have anything left. Why is this guy trying to try this case on a website? Because he is a loser!
“Greetings. I am Melvin Johnson, a friend for 18 of Mr. Williams’ 31 years of existence, as well as Attorney (now along with 2 others) on this matter.”
And don’t listen to the lawyers, God three of them, the poor widow won’t have anything left. Why is this guy trying to try this case on a website?
It may well be the only place it will be tried. Apparently, the Grand Jury reccomended the case closed (without seeing the video clip) and the DA first closed the case AFTER indicating that criminal charges may be filed, because he was upset that Johnson asked for a Federal investigation into the death.