When the Obama administration has finally reached its end, will there be any opportunity left in the United States to fulfill the values of self-reliance, entrepreneuralship? Most likely despite the lofty yet intrusive/scolding rhetoric the poor will find it even harder to change their lot (unless they get a job in DC).

Unfortunately there are hundreds of thousands of folks who WISH they'd been accepted into an Ivy League school (or their kids), continue to drink the Kool-Aide, and have to project a huge shield of denial to protect themselves from the salient points of your argument that threaten their societally suicidal constructs. In other words, I can't see Lee Ward, jp2, justice58 or Bruce Henry accepting any of your arguments.

I read the whole article. It was very well written, and brought up a couple of things I hadn't considered before.
But it ultimately boiled down to a multisyllabic version of "Waaah! The Meanie Liberal Media bashed her for not having 'book learning!'" Feel free to substitute "cultural elite" for "liberal media."
Look, I'm a liberal, not particularly educated (although I try to be as well-read as time, the Internet, and my local public library allows me), never made more than $55K/yr in my life. I vote with my gut just as much as my head, as, admit it, you guys do too.
What pisses me off about candidates like Palin is their seeming ability to make the average joe vote AGAINST their own self-interest. Even the author of the linked article admitted that the GOP uses cultural populism to sell policies that only benefit the investor class, those already able to take care of themselves.
I'll admit that I really, really, disliked Palin immediately. Despite what this author writes, I heard her saying "They think they're SSOOOO SMART!" every time she spoke. I hated her trying to divide us into "Real America" and "Fake America." And, honestly, I hated her voice and her fake Fargo accent just as I hated Bush's phonyass cowboy act. I work with guys every day who begin every argument with, "Well, ALL I KNOW IS, ...." and it drives me crazy. I got the same vibe from Palin. If that's all you know, you shouldn't run for VP.
But epador, thanks for thinking of me when I'm not around. I gotta admit, I forget you exist when I'm not actually reading one of your comments.

Gotta go with Bruce Henry on this one...she may be a grand mayor or governor....both very specific to a small audience, but as a major player in a country as diverse as the US,and a world that grows smaller by the hour, she would have been an absolute disaster. The polarizataion would have continued, and the left/right, good/evil, them us mentality would have worsened faster. Will it continue anyways? -perhaps, but I'm as moderate as they come, intellectually and financially. I watch whatever news happens to be on, she scared the living hell out of me, and pushed me to vote democrat this time. Not sold on Obama yet, but at least he can hold a coherent thought, and that's strikes me as a handy skill to have in this day and age.

"The polarizataion would have continued, and the left/right, good/evil, them us mentality would have worsened faster. Will it continue anyways?"

To cut through the crap, all this means is the elite liberals as embodied by the mass media leviathan will hold hold their breath kicking and screaming until they have absolute power.

Yeah, it "will continue anyways." But the leviathan will certainly keep it on the down low.

I still fail to see how, had McCain won, Palin would have been a disaster.

She was the VP candidate. V. P. The VP has exactly 2 duties accorded them by the Constitution. To step up if the #1 dies or is rendered incapable of executing the duties of the office. To cast the tie breaking vote in the Senate.

That's.

It.

For all the lambasting as Cheney got for HIS VP stint... he didn't really leave an impact. Why? Because he's the #2 guy that never stepped up to the plate. God, what a mental disconnect.

If McCain had picked anyone else, he may just have won. And we might not have all this hateorade drinking from the right towards anyone who criticizes the intelligence of the person they worship.

I'm sorry but when you say you have foreign policy experience because of Alaska's proximity to Russia that's just plain dumb. You can blame Katie Couric, or the dreaded "Liberal media" but no one forced her to say that, no one goaded her to say something so stupid.

Or remember how she didn't even know what the VP job entailed. Then later when asked, by a third grader, she didn't even know the constitution and what it said about the role the VP played. If Palin thought she could really "get in there with the senators and make a lot of good policy changes" then thank God she lost.

I mean come on, she even thought the media criticizing her was unconstitutional!

She's an ignorant ass, and will continue to be an ignorant ass.

The best thing for Liberals would be if Palin was named leader of the GOP and puts herself against Obama as the Republican candidate in 2012. She would guarantee another four years of Democrat power. Anyone else and Obama will have to be on his toes, with Palin it'll be a cakewalk.

I wish I could have written this post. My wife holds a Ph.D. in genetics and is married to a dumb old farmer. She is real. The people who think they are "smarter" are only fooling themselves. Palin is genuine. BH is just jealous.

Sarah Palin-Tonya Harding 2012!

Meow Bruce. Please stop pulling on my hair or I'll have to go back to a crew cut. You did a nice job of proving my point.

If McCain had picked anyone else, he may just have won.

Stupid talking point #1 from the scared-of-Palin leftroids. Absolutely false, as she brought in more votes for McCain from people who would have otherwise sat out the election. She is the biggest threat to Democrats power, and they want to marginalize her.

Stupid talking point #2 would be Bruce Henry's regurgitation of the "vote against their self-interest" line. Voting for the bread and circuses of the Democrats might seem like a good thing in the short term, but over and over we have seen how it tears down our economy. Even the CBO has indicated how Obama's stimulus will only provide a very minor short-term benefit, one not worth a trillion dollars, and it will hurt our economy for decades to come. The only people who had a self-interest in the Democrats coming to power are those who gave them millions, because now they expect their payday.

The Left is frankly terrified of Sarah Palin, and their mouthpieces in the "Press" are running weekly hit-pieces as a result.

The marginalized her this time around...but realize it will much harder in 2 years. So they are running and re-running the same old tired themes about her intelligence, sophistication and "lack of experience".

Meanwhile, Biden is running amok and alternatley pissing off the world, and pissing off his new Master.

Sarah pulled in VASTLY more votes than she lost. And she only "lost" those votes that the MSM could peel away through relentless pounding on her. Pounding, btw, that would NEVER have been tolerated were she a female candidate for the Dems.

Palin's common sense and REAL straight talk are like Kryptonite to the Left...and a shot in the arm to the Right!

Palin 2012!!

Palin's got her faults, but she remains so far superior to "Gird Your Loins" Biden that I'd vote for her again in a heartbeat.

May God grant long life to our President, as much as I dislike his policies, because Biden is far stupider than the worst BDS suffer thinks Bush is.

"Stupid talking point #1 from the scared-of-Palin leftroids. Absolutely false, as she brought in more votes for McCain from people who would have otherwise sat out the election." == John Irving

What John fails to see is that there are essentially 3 primary categories of voters: Republicans, Democrats, and Independents. So while the members of the Republican Base in 2008 were once again salivating at the opportunity to vote for someone even dumber than them, you can rest assured that Independents were turned off by Palin's stupidity.

John, a childish Republican dummy refusing to vote at all by sitting "out the election" is not going to be nearly as damaging to McCain as a moderate Independent switching his/her vote from McCain to Obama due to Caribou Barbie being on the Republican ticket.

Stupid talking point #2 would be Bruce Henry's regurgitation of the "vote against their self-interest" line.

Amen. And the catch-phrase "investor class" is getting a little tired, too. As if the only people investing in Wall Street are cartoon fat-cats with a top hat and a bag with a $ symbol on it.
Grow up, Bruce. Almost every working person in America has a pension, 401k or investment involved in the stock market.
Liberal jealosy and class-envy at it's finest.

"you can rest assured that Independents were turned off by Palin's stupidity"

Sorry, Herman - but I don't see how your assertion is factually based. If you actually look at her legislative record, you get quite the opposite picture.

Oh, I can see how you're desperate to paint 'Caribou Barbie' as completely unsuitable for high office - but all you've got to do is look at Pelosi (shudder) and Biden and compare what THEY'VE done to what Palin's gotten done in her time in public office - and I don't see how THEY have any right to their positions. (And let's not even talk about Kerry - not that he was in the running THIS election cycle, but the man hadn't accomplished ANYTHING in the last 30 years yet still got to almost be President. If that doesn't show you how 'connections' in the good ol' boy Beltway network are more important than anything else, I don't know what would.)

All in all, it seems to me like you're nowhere near as smart, analytical or independent-minded as you'd like to think you are.

The hateorade drinkers would like to think the left is scared of Palin. Yeah, we we're so scared of her on November 4th. We welcome her, she turned just about every independent blue simply because she's seen as right wing as Dubya was.

Plus she's comedic gold. SNL love her, the late night talk shows love her. So have a thought for all the poor comedians who thought losing Dubya was like loosing an arm, now they have Palin, the savior of comedy. LOL.

And in the end, the laugh's on us. Because political affiliation and connections are FAR more important than actual ability...

palinisevil - "Plus she's comedic gold. SNL love her, the late night talk shows love her. So have a thought for all the poor comedians who thought losing Dubya was like loosing an arm, now they have Palin, the savior of comedy. LOL."

Better spend a bit more time watching the late night and other comedy shows, Barack Hussein Obama has made more than a few appearances and with very comedic results.

What the meaning of Sarah Palin? From the comments I'd say a nice litmus test on how voters think: on one hand automatic partisans and on the other swing voters. The article glosses over this split calling it intellectual elitism and seems to imply this is strictly liberal bias. I think that is wishful thinking the couldn't be backed up with polling.

I think the article analysis is flawed; swing voters aka moderates tend to be thinkers and take some time to make up their minds but that doesn't mean they are liberals or conservatives or intellectual elites.

What the article doesn't mention that a number of conservatives who are thinkers (though maybe not members of the intellectual elite if there really is such a thing as a voting block and ideology) feel Palin is what I would call a train wreck waiting to happen. She's a bit of a showboater rather than a worker. While Reagan seems to acquired the reputation as a lightweight, his writings show he was no such thing. He might have delegated work, but he did his own thinking (Remember the end of the cold war?)

Sarah Palin may be attractive and have the right ideology, but as far as I can tell she's not a worker as far as learning things that bore her and she hires cronies rather than competent people. If you are a swing voter, how she treats Alaska, and the complaints of Alaskans would be of interest. This you can verify independently; just read the Alaska press.

I personally don't care if the person is pretty or ugly, intellectual elite or life smart, crazy accent and verbal gaffes or not; I just want them to do the job. Whatever George W Bush's faults nobody said he was a Diva, a whiner, a showboater, unresponsive, a clothes horse and unable and unwilling to hire competent people or get rid of screw-ups even if they had the right ideology. (Sorry, just reporting what's out there.) However with Sarah Palin he does have the honor of being intellectually uncurious, but he DID hire competent people. That really is a night and day difference.

Spoken like true right-wing tools. How many of them were hypnotized by Palin's annoying and empty repetition of "Average Joe" while laughing at Obama supporters for admiring his message of change and hope? You want a "non-intellectual" President? Go down to the local bar and tell me how many Presidents you see. Her weaknesses go far beyond her use of a different language. She was an incompetent leader, proven by both her past and her campaign.

Some people are smart enough to realize that they won't make a good President. The idea that Average Joe the Plumber Six-Pack can be President is downright stupid.

The leaders of our country need to be intelligent. Palin wasn't. Admit it.

Mike -

Considering how Palin was castigated for supposedly attempting to get rid of an underperforming police chief it's funny you say she was 'ineffectual'.

(By the way, better not look into Obama's job performace if that's what you were basing your vote on. He failed as a community organizer, the Annenburg challenge did no good, his time as a State senator was pretty much wasted (google up Grove Parc) and he didn't do anything as a US senator but run for office. Oh, how EFFECTIVE! (feels tingle...))

Man, do you realize how stupid you look mindlessly repeating what the media was doing to Palin? Your little disclaimer "hey,it was just what was reported!" doesn't cut it. Did you bother actually looking into her record, or is trustingly accepting the word of a group which had a manifest agenda in making sure McCain's opponent was elected substitute for analytical thought and reasoning in your world?

Proud Intellectual -

As a class, I've found self-anointed 'intellectuals' usually are the least capable of people outside their professed specialties, and they're the most dismissive of those who don't self-identify as 'intellectual'.

You try to come off as aristocracy, but would have trouble coping with the real world without those you so willingly despise.

I agree wtih the article completely, It shows that stupid is a universal illness no matter matter what school you go to. Even Bush's ivy league education could not overcome is utter lack of intelligence.

Pro-Palinites, get over it. God doesn't make everyone a mental giant. So, He chose to bless her with skills more suited to killing animals.

The difference isn't elitist vs non-elitist or ivy league vs not. The difference is that a large majority of American public can recognize that she's not very bright, but there are still those who are even lower on the mental totem pole than Palin, so honestly believe that she actually is capable of comprehending economics.

Her free ride in AK has run out, we'll see where they are a year from now.

Whether Palin would have made a great or bad vice president I have no idea. It is amazing that the so called tolerant left already has judged her as incompetent, stupid, and zealot, and idiot and her personal family is fair game. Way to go lefties.

Secondly, the elite establishment is what is hurting this country so much at this time. Yet the left embraces them as it feeds at their plantation. What does that say about the left? You decide.

Palinevil quoted SNL as the sign of collapse, so Obama and the governor of NY is incompetent also.

Joe Biden was the senator of a very small state and he possessed not executive experience, yet you lefties embrace him as the second coming.

My conclusion is the left lies and lives in their lies. Normal straight people would call it denial, but, it is what it is.

Bruce Henry, kudo's for admitting you hated Palin right out of the shoot. Wrong and prejudicial but at least your honest. ww

"...her views on matters of cultural and social controversy very quickly became the chief focus of media attention, liberal criticism, and pundit analysis. We were told that Palin was opposed to contraception, advocated teaching creationism in schools, and was inclined to ban books she disagreed with. She was described as a religious zealot, an anti-abortion extremist, a blind champion of abstinence-only sex education. She was said to have sought to make rape victims pay for their own medical exams, to have Alaska secede from the Union, and to get Pat Buchanan elected President. She was reported to believe that the Iraq war was mandated by God, that the end-times prophesied in the Book of Revelation were nearing and only Alaska would survive, and that global warming was purely a myth. None of this was true."

Wait. All of this was true. That's why it was out there. She has never pretended otherwise and makes no apology. She hasn't substantively refuted any of this. These views are the basis for broad approval by conservative Christians across the country and is the basis for VP nomination.
Ya can't have it both ways...and why would you want to?

Huckabee: "Sarah Palin is a pleasant surprise for those of us who had hoped that Senator McCain would pick a principled and authentic conservative pro-life leader."

Bloggers on Huckabee's PAC:
"The fact is that Sarah Palin is a strong conservative and that is what we wanted... As far as what is biblically appropriate for Sarah Palin's life choices concerning her children and work balance, scripture points to unity and submission. Are Sarah and Todd Palin unified? Absolutely. Is Sarah Palin in submission to her husband as her leader in their home? Absolutely... If she is submissive to her husband and he encouraged and wanted her to pursue these high offices (which he admittedly did) then HE will answer to God as whether it is right or not because he is the leader of their home. - her job is to be in submission to him."

"I look at her as a gift from God. The gift I have been praying for the last two months. I see the power of God..."

"We wanted a strong, pro-life, pro-family Republican ticket, and we HAVE it."

"...it is safe to assume Governor Palin and her husband are competent to see that their children are nurtured. Read Proverbs 31 again--it describes one busy businesslady."

"Okay, so she is anti-abortion and an evangelical. How does she stand on the REAL issues? What is her stand on the FairTax?...I have searched all around and cannot find much information about her ideas/thoughts on the subject."

"Whatever George W Bush's faults nobody said he was a Diva, a whiner, a showboater, unresponsive, a clothes horse and unable and unwilling to hire competent people or get rid of screw-ups even if they had the right ideology. (Sorry, just reporting what's out there.)"

Bwahahaha!

Although you have a point there on the "clothes horse" thing, the rest is, well, silly.

And I, for one, am not for a second taking commentary regarding Sarah Palin from someone going by the name "palinisevil" seriously. I'm sorry, it's just too absurd to even consider.

Less, when I used the phrase "investor class" I was QUOTING THE AUTHOR.
And GC's comment is correct. There was no conspiracy to destroy Palin. She did that all on her own.
Wee Willie, the phrase is "out of the chute," you know, like in the Rodeo. I realize that folks with book-larnin' ain't s'posed to know 'bout no rodeo, but, dagnabbit, some of 'em do.
Any Republican who wants to claim that his vote is always about cool analysis and is made disregarding any emotional factor is a liar. Just as is any Democratwho makes the same claim.

Wait. All of this was true. That's why it was out there. She has never pretended otherwise and makes no apology. She hasn't substantively refuted any of this.

So your standard of what's true are things that are out there and which the subject doesn't dignify with proof it's wrong. By that standard Obama is Muslim and not a natural born citizen.

But Oyster, you seem to agree with the genius who posts here under the nom de plume, "Nobama."
I for one prefer to post under my real name. That's the best policy, right, Mollusk?

There was no conspiracy to destroy Palin. She did that all on her own.

So you think she started the rumor that her daughter Bristol gave birth to Trig? Or that Palin initiated the politically motivated troopergate investigation? As for the media questions, Gibson's was a trick question that Obama couldn't answer either because there are several Bush doctrines. Sarah didn't enjoy the MSM's good will that Obama got such as Stephanopoulos quickly correcting Obama's blunder that he's Muslim.

Maybe Palin will run for the senate in 2010, which will give her an opportunity to gain national and foreign policy experience. The nation will be ready for real change and real hope by 2016. She'll be 52 by then and likely a far more formidable candidate then anything the democrats have in the wings.

The meaning of Sarah Palin is not a class war between real decent people and some kind of elite class. I'm not of that class and not particularly formally educated. But I know what newspapers and magazines I read and Sarah makes me feel like an intellectual. To equate her somehow with native people's values of long ago, makes me want to spit. Those who defend her are not as smart as she is. And I feel for them.

little bruce.
Your writing shows you think you are smart.
Not. Start thinking.

Mac Lorry - So your standard of what's true are things that are out there and which the subject doesn't dignify with proof it's wrong. By that standard Obama is Muslim and not a natural born citizen.

Obviously, Obama isn't attempting to appeal to a faction of American voters by stating HIMSELF that he's Muslim and a foreign national. Someone else has that as a issue of focus and he's ignored it.
If you're going to compare it, that would suggest that Sarah is not conservative Christian of evangelical faith, that she is not staunchly pro-life, that she supports modern science theory regarding climate change and planetary development, etc etc.

First of all, the things that you say are "not true" are discoverable and on record. So, go find out.
It sounds like you find those things undesirable and negative. I don't understand that. Those things are what defines her, her platform, and what appeals to conservative Christians. If she's not those things, then what is she?

If you don't like those things, then how is it that you support Sarah Palin?

But I know what newspapers and magazines I read and Sarah makes me feel like an intellectual.

And I know how many states there are and what my religion is. Obama makes Sarah look like an intellectual.

And I know how many states there are and what my religion is.

And if you are still claiming that Obama stated his religion incorrectly, then you are emphatically either a non-intellectual, or a liar.

"The leaders of our country need to be intelligent. And Palin wasnt. Admit it."

The leaders of our Country need to have morals and ethics..The current crowd of shady vote cheating thugs have neither.

I link to the best series of Conservative deconstructions of the Palin candidacy, each ahead of the curve. ("Search" forward and back and see!) I choose this particular column only because of its glamorous and timely mentioning of "Georgia" and "The Weekly Standard" ahead of the disastrous ABC interview and the justified drubbing Bush and Shakashvili (and Poor Palin) took when the Russians or the American public refused to be impressed by the soup d'jour and entree presented.

The Commentary article linked by m.l. is a funny attempt by a neocon rag to blame America (again!) for (somehow!) not *getting it*. The seedy (and desperate) lashing out at neoconservative fellow travelers like Hitchens and Brooks is rich indeed.

http://buchanan.org/blog/2008/09/neocons-palinproject/

If you're going to compare it, that would suggest that Sarah is not conservative Christian of evangelical faith, that she is not staunchly pro-life, that she supports modern science theory regarding climate change and planetary development, etc etc.

Well Sarah certainly is a conservative and she's Christian, but that's not a negative in the eyes of most voters.

In your post #25 you quoted part of Levin's article "We were told that Palin was opposed to contraception, advocated teaching creationism in schools, and was inclined to ban books she disagreed with."

Sarah didn't need to refute such allegations as they were quickly debunked by others, yet even when debunked some people still believe them as in your case. Yuval Levin even debunks some of these assertions such as Sarah being staunchly pro-life. Sarah chose not to abort Trig, but she was not active in trying to ban other women from making their own choice.

As for the modern science theory regarding climate change are you talking about the one that says the climate follows the cycles of the sun or are you talking about the scam Al Gore in promoting? If it's Al Gore's AGW scam, then Sarah now has the majority of scientists on her side.

As for the science of planetary development, if you are talking about evolution then it's just the religion of scientists and like all other religions it's founded on a tenet of faith.

First of all, the things that you say are "not true" are discoverable and on record. So, go find out. It sounds like you find those things undesirable and negative. I don't understand that.

You need to go back and read the first paragraph of your post #25. It's a list of hearsay allegations about what her policies are, to which you said "All of this was true". Most of those allegations were debunked during the campaign and there's no evidence any of them are true. It doesn't follow that just because someone writes about them they are true. Nor are they true because she is a conservative, a Christian, and gave birth to Trig.

Those things are what defines her, her platform, and what appeals to conservative Christians. If she's not those things, then what is she?

What defines Sarah Palin is her strength of character, her family values, work ethic, honesty, moral values, her support for religious freedom, and civil liberties (after the supreme court ruling we know the 2nd amendment is an individual right just as the much as the 1st amendment is). Sarah is the embodiment of gender and racial equality liberals only give mouth service to. Sarah has a pragmatic approach to balancing the environment and energy development. She knows instinctively and in an instant what intellectuals ponder for years and then get wrong. Sarah is a leader. That's why I support her.

And if you are still claiming that Obama stated his religion incorrectly, then you are emphatically either a non-intellectual, or a liar.

I saw the interview and George Stephanopoulos had to correct Obama. If you are saying it didn't happen than your are emphatically either a non-intellectual, or a liar.

I saw the interview and George Stephanopoulos had to correct Obama. If you are saying it didn't happen than your are emphatically either a non-intellectual, or a liar.

No, you're just apparently too juvenile to have understood the context. (Actually, I believe that you understood it quite well, but just like to repeat the canard because it's fun to say. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong and you actually are just dim.)

MR. STEPHANOPOULOS: You mentioned your Christian faith. Yesterday, you took after the Republicans for suggesting you have Muslim connections. ... MR. STEPHANOPOULOS: But the McCain campaign has never suggested you have Muslim connections. ... SEN. OBAMA: ...you're absolutely right that John McCain has not talked about my Muslim faith

It's pretty damn clear what he's saying is that McCain had not personally talked about Obama being a Muslim. It would be as if McCain said, "Obama has not talked about me fathering an illegitimate black child" or "Obama has not talked about me being senile". That doesn't mean McCain would be admitting to those things, just that he'd be acknowledging Obama himself hasn't been spreading them.

If that wasn't clear enough (and as I said above I'm sure it was), in the very next sentence Obama made it plain to Stephanopoulos what point he was making:

MR. STEPHANOPOULOS (interrupting): Your Christian faith.

SEN. OBAMA: My Christian faith - well, what I'm saying is that he hasn't suggested that I'm a Muslim

But goody, just cut off the video before he says that, and you have a nice little lie going.

This is off the post topic, but I thought it was important to expose your disingenuous claims lest anyone gave fleeting thought to paying your other statements any attention.

"The leaders of our Country need to have morals and ethics..The current crowd of shady vote cheating thugs have neither."

And I do question their intelligence, 914. Devious cunning isn't quite the same thing...

I wonder if they will fix the blockquote rendering before the next presidential election.

Of course, the real purpose of all the foot-stamping, squealing, and mudslinging by the leftroids on here is to distract from the failings of the n00b-in-chief.

I gave him a fair chance after the election, he made it through his inauguration and hasn't stopped f**cking up since. He's made more mistakes in less than a month than Bush did in eight years, and has 47 more to go to continue making the country regret buying into a smooth-talking neophyte.

It is as if we are all passengers on Flight 1549, and we pulled Sulzberger and his co-pilot on the recommendation of a slick salesman who has no pilots license but bought a copy of Microsoft Flight Simulator and his best buddy even started it once. He wants to be the hero, and will show us all the safest way for a water landing is nose down.

Good going, folks. Palin could be (but isn't) exactly as bad as you think, and she'd still do no damage whatsoever as VP compared to what your Hope+Change will do as POTUS.

Forget Sarah Palin. Bobby Jindal is much better at every level.,

"Not sold on Obama yet, but at least he can hold a coherent thought, and that's strikes me as a handy skill to have in this day and age."

Which coherent thought? President Obama always speaks double-tongue; he is a walking, talking contradiction ie 'we have nothing to fear BUT act now in fear of catastrophe'.

The problem with trying to attack Gov Palin as an non-intellectual is that we now have a President who is an insanely crazy chameleon who changes his words and appearances the moment he faces trouble; Obama may be cool however this is as far as it goes.

I guarantee that by this time next year Gov Palin will the genius compared to President Obama who will be the most hated politician in America; it has already begun, he has done so many crazy things in less than three weeks even Liberal voters are beginning to regret their vote for him.

President Obama campaigned on change yet it turns out he was just playing a notorious Chicago mob confidence game; the biggest suckers were the affluent, Ivy League educated and they are the people who will be humiliated by the fact that they were so easily swindled.

Brucy and Brian, admit it, you bet your wad on a losing horse. You were driven by emotion. Now the country is collapsing because of the poor democratic congressional leadership over the last 3 years. You are indirectly resposible for the future problems. ww

This is off the post topic, but I thought it was important to expose your disingenuous claims lest anyone gave fleeting thought to paying your other statements any attention.

I saw the interview not the edited clip. Your entire defense of Obama fails on the simple fact that George Stephanopoulos stopped and corrected Obama. Unless you're so childish as to claim George Stephanopoulos doesn't understand English even you have to agree that Obama blundered.

Only because Stephanopoulos called the blunder to Obama's attention was he able to make a quickly recovery. Had Obama been treated like Palin, Stephanopoulos would have just moved on and the headline in the NYT the next day would have been Obama admits his Muslim faith. Then the MSM would have blackballed Obama's subsequent explanation or ran it on page 18.

While it's off top I just wanted to expose you hypocrisy in defending Obama's blunders while exaggerating Palin's blunders lest anyone gave fleeting thought to paying your other statements any attention.

Wee Willie, were you old enough to vote in 2000? (Are you old enough now?)
If you were, are you going to tell me that you voted for Bush solely on the basis of reasoned analysis of each candidate's policies and capabilities? Or could part of your decision have been based on Gore seeming like a wimpy smartypants, and Bush seeming like a "guy you could have a beer with?"

And I have to laugh at Mr Irving's characterization of some comments as "foot-stamping, squealing, and mud-slinging" while calling the commenters "leftroids" and calling the President of the United States a "noob-in-chief" and a "slick salesman."

I don't see the comments here critical of Palin as any more foot-stampy than the ones defending her. Maybe less so. Look at syn calling Obama an "insanely crazy chameleon" who will soon be "the most hated politician in America" because he is playing a "Chicago confidence game."

What defines Sarah Palin is her strength of character, her family values, work ethic, honesty, moral values, her support for religious freedom, and civil liberties (after the supreme court ruling we know the 2nd amendment is an individual right just as the much as the 1st amendment is). Sarah is the embodiment of gender and racial equality liberals only give mouth service to.

Mac, it seems you already worship at the altar of Palin. The more we hate her the more you'll love her, it's the same with Obama. It's the same with any right vs left politician really. We'll see in 2012 what she can do, i could say 2010 but i actually hope that the GOP get Congress back. We saw from 2001 to 2006 what a mess a government can make of the country when it controls both houses and the Oval Office.

So in 2012 we'll see if Palin has actually learnt anything of value, or if she's learnt to talk coherently and intelligently without all the folksy "you betcha" crap. Or if she's still simply dumb trailer trash.

"So in 2012 we'll actually see if Palin has learnt anything of value, or if She learnt to talk coherently and intelligently without all the folksy "you betcha" crap. Or if She is still simply trailer trash."

Obuma has already made a bigger mess in three weeks than even the lowest positive approval BDS Congress failures have in 2 years.

As for "trailer trash" You meet the definition precisely.

And then along comes # 49, undermining my point. Thanks, friend.

And then along comes # 49, undermining my point.

And underscoring mine.

calling the President of the United States a "noob-in-chief" and a "slick salesman."

He is a n00b, of the worst kind, bought into a level he has no idea how to play at. How did he do this? He's a slick salesman.

You got rolled, folks. He has no clue how to be President.

For eight years we had people sufering from Bush Derangement Syndrome, the delusion that Bush could do nothing right. Now we have people with Obama Derangement Syndrome, the belief that The One can do no wrong.

I'm sure Obama will get a few things right, by stopped clock statistics anyway, but he will do far more damage with the things he is tremendously wrong about.

At least McCain and Palin know that Russians play hardball. Barack went for the touchie feelie huggie and got kneed in the groin.

Your entire defense of Obama fails on the simple fact that George Stephanopoulos stopped and corrected Obama. Unless you're so childish as to claim George Stephanopoulos doesn't understand English even you have to agree that Obama blundered.

Clearly Stephanopoulos at first didn't get what Obama meant either, and yes, he "corrected" him... incorrectly. And then Obama corrected him back. Did you see that part, or did you only stop watching after Stephanopoulos's "correction"?

Only because Stephanopoulos called the blunder to Obama's attention was he able to make a quickly recovery.

No, only because Stephanopoulos indicated that he didn't understand was Obama able to rephrase his point so that it was more clear. I'm sure that's never happened to you, eh?

Had Obama been treated like Palin, Stephanopoulos would have just moved on and the headline in the NYT the next day would have been Obama admits his Muslim faith.

Well the headline on the right-wing blogs would have been the same. But English speakers would have understood what he was saying. As I said above, if McCain said "Obama hasn't talked about me being having an illegitimate baby", do you think the headline in the NYT would have been "McCain admits to illegitimate child"?

While it's off top I just wanted to expose you hypocrisy in defending Obama's blunders

I don't defend his blunders. The real ones, not the fake ones.

while exaggerating Palin's blunders

They need no exaggerating.

I can see you having fun with Obama's statement, but to watch you sit here and contort the language and understanding so you can insist on lying is surprising even for you.

Mac, it seems you already worship at the altar of Palin. The more we hate her the more you'll love her, it's the same with Obama.

Well I wouldn't go so far as to say I worship Palin, but she has qualities I admire. Being picked for VP by McCain was both beneficial and damaging to Sarah's speculative presidential run at some point in the future. The benefit was national exposure that was mostly positive. But there was damage done because she wasn't ready for the left's frantic mud slinging nor the MSM's gotcha game. Unlike a presidential candidate who has a long time to think about running and to prepare themselves, Sarah got a call out of the blue and soon found herself on the national stage. Even so, she certainly held her own against Biden and with a lot fewer blunders. The problem was that, because of McCain's age and health history, Sarah was in effect running against Obama, not Biden.

We'll see in 2012 what she can do

Unless Obama's first four years are an utter disaster, Sarah would be smart to wait until 2016, particularly if she can get elected to the senate in 2010.

Or if she's still simply dumb trailer trash.

Anyone who thinks Sarah is dumb is going to get caught with their pants down. Someone should take a poll and see if American's prefer a president to be more trailer trash or more intellectual holier-than-thou snob. I expect the results would be surprising.

Clearly Stephanopoulos at first didn't get what Obama meant either, and yes, he "corrected" him... incorrectly. And then Obama corrected him back. Did you see that part, or did you only stop watching after Stephanopoulos's "correction"?

Had Stephanopoulos not known that Obama was Christian he would have had no reason to prompt Obama. However, Stephanopoulos understood exactly what Obama said and knew it was not what he meant, and because he was not playing gotcha, alerted him. Obama then corrected what he said to "My Christian faith" demonstrating even to the dimwitted that Obama knew he had blundered.

You can spin all you want, but both Stephanopoulos and Obama recognized the statement as a blunder. Had Stephanopoulos been playing gotcha with Obama that Freudian slip would have been as damaging as any blunder Palin made.

I can see you having fun with Obama's statement, but to watch you sit here and contort the language and understanding so you can insist on lying is surprising even for you.

Given your level of reading comprehension I have no need to lie.

"Anyone who thinks Sarah is dumb is going to get caught with their pants down."

Well, she is. Not a dumbell, but just plain incurious like the previous occupant. We don't need another one of those in office.

It's nice to actually get someone in there who is not an embarrassment when they open their mouth. For the right, I would say if you want to promote Palin as your standardbearer, please go at it. It will only benefit the left.

Actually, it's put far more eloquently in an article here:

verbalpaintball.com/?p=206

Mr Irving, you really shouldn't engage in foot-stamping, squealing, and mud-slinging if it offends you when others do it.

"Not a dumbell, but just plain incurious like the previous occupant. We don't need another one of those in office."

Exactly.

Well, just for the record I'd like to amend my Repulican dream ticket from "Palin/Huckabee 2012" to:

Palin/Thune 2012!!

Dumb and Dumberer.

Well, she is. Not a dumbell, but just plain incurious like the previous occupant. We don't need another one of those in office.

The "George Bush is incurious" meme is a myth that has been busted any number of times by those who actually know him. And when Sarah Palin was in high school, she had a reputation of being a bookworm.

But keep on closing your eyes and repeating your myths to yourself. Bush rolled you guys several times and you're setting yourself up to get rolled again.

Bruce, my derision of The N00b is based on his performance, which is dismal. Your criticism of Palin is based on your personal fantasies, preprogrammed talking points, and knee-jerk defense of your even-more-idiotic fellow travellers in the comments.

Oh yeah, I remember the "Book Reading Contest" Bush had with Rove. Supposedly the Preznit read a book a week.
Gee, with all that book-readin', exercisin', and brushclearin', and going to bed by 10 pm every night, it's no wonder he didn't get around to doin' much Presidentin'.
"Sarah palin had a reputation as a bookworm." Yes, I'm sure she always had her nose buried in a Harlequin Romance. Come on!

And whatever its basis, Mr Irving, it's still foot-stamping, squealing, and mud-slinging. Not that I've got anything against foot-stampers, squealers, and mud-slingers, mind you, only those who accuse others of it while simulyaneously doing it themselves.

Well, she is. Not a dumbell, but just plain incurious like the previous occupant. We don't need another one of those in office.

You're judging style not substance. Less than 4 years ago Bush tried to modernize Social Security, but Obama and other democrats opposed that effort claiming Social Security was on sound financial basis and needed no changes. Within the first week in office, however, Obama was hinting that Social Security needed changes. Apparently it was Obama who was incurious about Social Security at a time when it was an important issue. He'll soon blunder onto the third rail while looking like an intellectual. Such is the fate of those who put style above substance.

You mean like my knee-jerk defense of # 49, Mr Irving?
My actual criticisms of Palin, some admittedly emotionally based, are:
Her inability to form coherent English sentences.
Her deer-in-the-headlights stare when asked about the Bush Doctrine.
Her attempt to paint pathetic losers like Katie Freaking Couric and Charlie Freaking Gibson as master interrogators tripping her up with Gotcha questions your mailman could have answered.
Her inability to name even one periodical she read regularly.
Her division of the country into "Real" America and the rest of us.
Her sneering at "community organizers." Imagine air quote fingers here.
Her pathetic attempt to paint every criticism of anything she said as an attack by meanie smartypantses.
Her playing of the Howling Mob card at her rallies, practically calling an Obama a terrorist sympathizer.
Last I heard, the RNC still didn't have those clothes back.
Her "also, too's", which I didn't think was becoming on a world leader. Ditto the inappropriate and creepy winking.
Her cynical attempt to steal the "Hillary vote" by running as a Vagina-American, despite the fact she opposed most tenets of modern feminism.
And, again, the nails-on-the-blackboard voice and the fake Fargo accent.
Like I say, every vote isn't based solely on logic. Mine or yours. I wasn't going to vote for McCain no matter who he chose, but Palin was gravy.

# 63, I could be wrong, but did the Democrats really claim NO changes were needed? It seems to me that we only objected to the "need" to privatize SS.
And it's a damn good thing we did. Where would your SS money be now if Bush had had his way? In about the same shape as your 401K?

# 63, I could be wrong, but did the Democrats really claim NO changes were needed? It seems to me that we only objected to the "need" to privatize SS.

The democrats did claim changes were not needed, and they did object to privatizing as well because where would the money come from to fund the change over? Well, where is the money coming from to fund TARP and the stimulus bill? The government just prints it and tries to sell the debt to China. It's not only easy to abort the unborn it's easy to tax them too.

And it's a damn good thing we did. Where would your SS money be now if Bush had had his way? In about the same shape as your 401K?

Bush wasn't going to force anyone to put their FICA into private funds, but would have given people the choice. Some people know how to invest and some don't. My 401k did quite well and has always earned a positive return. Now people have to worry about SS being there for them at anywhere near what it's now paying. Cutting payroll taxes to stimulate the economy is going to exacerbate the problem. Obama is looking more and more incurious in his actions, all the while talking a good game and looking smart. It's style over substance.

Such is the fate of those who put style above substance.

I always said that about, Palin. :)

Mac, i agree Palin would have some qualities i would admire. But they're overshadowed by her ignorance and seemingly boundless pursuit of celebrity. And for the love of God would someone stop her using Trig as a photo op.

Unlike a presidential candidate who has a long time to think about running and to prepare themselves, Sarah got a call out of the blue and soon found herself on the national stage.

Biden seemed to cope very well, and didn't make all these mistakes you pertain to.

Unless Obama's first four years are an utter disaster, Sarah would be smart to wait until 2016, particularly if she can get elected to the senate in 2010.

I agree. Let her get into the Senate, let her see what she's really letting herself in for. And then self destruct in a fiery ball of corruption and debauchery.

Anyone who thinks Sarah is dumb is going to get caught with their pants down. Someone should take a poll and see if American's prefer a president to be more trailer trash or more intellectual holier-than-thou snob. I expect the results would be surprising.

I have to disagree here. She's not bright, and she tried to charm people by playing on the fact that she's not bright. She has charisma i'll give her that, but that's all she has. When faced with any difficult questions out came the rhetoric and the "you betcha" crap. See the Katie Couric interview for a perfect example.

I suppose it depends where you live, here in Boston we would be, we were, repelled by trailer trash. I'm not saying "intellectual holier-than-thou snob" is great either but if faced with that choice we and most of the population, i.e. east and west coast, would pick the snob.

Bruce -

Yep, the Democrats were claiming that there was nothing wrong with social security, and it shouldn't be touched. Of course, Clinton said pre-Bush that it needed reform, but nothing got done about THAT - the potential problem was too far down the line. The problem was brought up in Reagan's time - but nothing ever got acted on then, since a Republican would have gotten credit, and the House and Senate were solidly Democratic.

I'm starting to see a trend. Any problem that can be taken care of with minor intervention early on (like the Fannie Mae stuff) will be shoved off until it becomes a monumental crisis, requiring much more of an outlay than simply taking care of the problem when it first surfaced would require - ESPECIALLY if by averting the problem it gives credit or legitimacy to the opposing political faction.

yet failed to consume a large enough portion of the Kool-Aid as to render himself a babbling practitioner of progressive post-modernism

You really think people's problem with George W. Bush is he didn't read enough Derrida? Wow, you fools are more lost than I thought.

Not that I've got anything against foot-stampers, squealers, and mud-slingers, mind you, only those who accuse others of it while simulyaneously doing it themselves.

Your self-hated is an ugly thing, Bruce. Let it go before it consumes you. . . wait, you're an Obamatron, too late.

As I said the reason for your squealing prattle is to distract from His N00bness' rapid failure as President.

Biden seemed to cope very well, and didn't make all these mistakes you pertain to.

Biden was a presidential candidate, which goes to my point that he was able to prepare well in advance. Even then Joe is known as much for his gaffes as he is for his views on issues.

I have to disagree here. She's not bright, and she tried to charm people by playing on the fact that she's not bright.

Guess we'll just have to disagree then, like that's unusual. Obama may poison the public's esteem for intellectuals, so charm and a connection to the common people could be a winning combination in 2016. It's all speculation at this point.

You can spin all you want, but both Stephanopoulos and Obama recognized the statement as a blunder.

Not spin, just reality. Stephanopoulos thought it was a blunder, and Obama told him it wasn't. I suppose that since McCain proclaimed that he was a proud liberal, you now hold him to that. And you still avoid answering what you'd think if McCain said "Obama hasn't talked about me being senile".

Given your level of reading comprehension I have no need to lie.

If you're not lying, then you're just demented. I'm sure you and the "Obama doesn't have a valid birth certificate" crowd have much fun at parties.

Not spin, just reality. Stephanopoulos thought it was a blunder, and Obama told him it wasn't.

Nonsense. Stephanopoulos corrected Obama by saying "Your Christian faith" followed immediately by Obama accepting the correction and saying "My Christian faith". The rest was an explanation of what he meant, not a refutation that he misspoke. Stephanopoulos came to Obama's rescue, which was just the opposite of what Palin got from the MSM.

And you still avoid answering what you'd think if McCain said "Obama hasn't talked about me being senile".

If Obama had used your phrase and said "McCain has not talked about me being Muslim" Stephanopoulos wouldn't have needed to correct him. If McCain had used Obama's phrase and said "Obama has not talked about my senility" it would have been a major blunder. Hopefully your reading comprehension is up to distinguishing the difference.

The point of my post #34, which started this exchange, was that just because Palin made some blunders doesn't mean she's dumb. Obama made blunders as well, so does that make him dumb? I don't know of any politician who doesn't make silly blunders. The only reason to focus on them to the exclusion of issues is that iliberals like to claim they are disqualifying when conservatives make them while dismissing the ones liberals make. Now that's demented.

Re # 68:
Mr Lawson, I don't know how old you are, but there WAS a Social security crisis in the 1980s. It was about to go under. Reagan and Speaker O"Neill created a blue ribbon commission and reforms were instituted that lasted until the present day.
Now my recollection of the 2005 SS fight differ from yours. While there may have been a few Democrats arguing that "nothing" needed to be done, my memory is that they were saying that Bush's alarmist rhetoric was more of the fear-mongering he was so good at. And that privatization was a bad idea.
See, while yours may be the only 401K in America that hasn't taken a hit,no doubt due to your genius-level financial acumen, most people who still have 401Ks they haven't cashed in yet have taken a hell of a hit. A hit of about 30 -- 40%!
People have been saying "I'll never see a Social Security check, it'll be all gone by the time I can collect!" since about 1945.

Shorter John Irving: "I have nothing of value to say, so I'll just stamp my feet, squeal, and sling mud at BH."

I have no trouble understanding Sarah because she speaks my dialect. She obviously knows what she's talking about if one actually listens to her. It would help her the most if she practiced slowing down so that the slow folks could keep up with her.

That people hear an unusual mode of speech and automatically think "stupid" is prejudice.

And if a person actually listens to what she says, she comes across as practical and able to properly prioritize.

Which is part of the (non)-problem of her supposed incuriosity... she's got her mind on business, which as the governor of Alaska is Alaska's business. When she got home again she answered the "what now" question with an entirely cogent iteration of how falling gas prices were going to affect the Alaskan economy *and* that they'd already planned for it. She didn't have to search for some meaningless back to work phrase that would sound good, because she really *was* back to work and had no trouble with evaluating priorities or understanding how it all related together.

Anyone who thinks that she can't do this on a national level given more than a week or two to cram, hasn't been paying attention.

(And it's not just Trig... she'd get the same hate from feminists just for being a conservative and a breeder.)

But Mac... pray please she does *not* run for the Senate.

Mr Lawson, the trend you see doesn't exist when you look into the real history of the SS debate in the 1980s.

You said, "The problem was brought up in Reagan's time -- but nothing ever got acted on then, since a Republican would have gotten credit, and the House and senate were solidly Democratic."

This statement is false. One, the House had a solid Democratic majority, but Republican Howard Baker was Senate Majority Leader (52--48).

Two, Reagan and Speaker Tip O'Neill appointed a bipartisan commission that "saved" SS, and their solution has lasted until now. Reagan usually gets the lion's share of the credit.

I await your admission of error.

Bruce Henry attempts to project on to those of us who love the Declaration of Independence, the United States Constitution and the Bill of Rights and who revere the memory of our beloved fraternal republic's Founding Fathers (and who are otherwise known of as "conservatives" and as Republicans) his telling admission that he, as is typical -- definitive, even, of "liberals," votes the way he feels.

Sadly such men can never be made to understand the difference between the ideas and the moral integrity that drive Republicanism and that motivate and guide the actions of the likes of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin, on the one hand -- and their own uniformly corrupt politicians' cynical exploitation of the feelings poor Bruce Henry and his ilk are barely able to verbalize. As are all of those too stupid to know they're being lied to and/or that they are in every electoral cycle and/or who are criminal aliens and/or are felons and/or are crypto-fascists -- and/or are by any other name, "the Democrats!"

Brian Richard Allen
Los Angeles CalifOBAMAcated 90028 and the Far Abroad

PALIN/JINDAL2012