JayTea,

Stop sharing DJ's brain already!

Jay, I only jump into the 'debate' after I saw a clear case of hypocrisy exhibited by other commenters (i.e. Clinton/Lewinski).

As a Catholic, we do not believe in divorce, and adultery is a sin (punishable by death according to the bible both old and new testaments).

I don't know what you call a women that sleeps with a known married man that accepts a sweet-heart contract from the DoD setup by her lover and accepts a $60K (tax free) raise from the same, and please separated is still married.

At least I did acknowledge my diversion from the topic and contributed my thoughts on the impeachment threat.

Happy Mission Accomplish Day

Jay, execellent piece.

It only takes a quick peruse of the blogs to see the left's profound hatred and classless on display. Wishing Cheney to die of heart disease to the cheering of Tony Snow having cancer right on down to our own Barney referring to someone he doesn't know as a slut.

On the other side I saw alot of sympathy for Gov, Corzine and Senator Johnson with their recent medical problems. Notably by the "right wing hate machine" people as well as the left.

Waiting for part 2.

As a Catholic...

And as a fellow Catholic, you should know better than to call someone a "slut".

"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

Other than that, diverting/changing from the subject is left-wing tactic as old as the hills. It's right up there with the "shout-down" tactic I learned during the 80s from protest organizers in--where else--Berkeley, CA.

Jay,

That's all well and good, but what do you think about the U.S. not signing the Kyoto treaty?

It's time to push them over the edge -- Democrats have crossed the line and it's now time to question their patriotism. Democrats are now openly aiding and abetting the enemy. If not, ask where is the line Democrats will not cross.

btw Barney, once again, the "Mission Accomplished" banner was put up by the crew of the Lincoln to denote the airwing and ship's crew's success in completing THEIR missions. Per my ex-neighbor and personal friend, a senior ship'd officer aboard the Lincoln.

Of course this isn't what you wish to believe, or how the media spun it.

Happy "glad to be an American" day

"As a Catholic, we do not believe in divorce, and adultery is a sin (punishable by death according to the bible both old and new testaments)."

Where is adultery punishable by death in the New Testament?

"As a Catholic, we do not believe in divorce, and adultery is a sin (punishable by death according to the bible both old and new testaments)."

Wow, and lacking in Biblical knowledge also. The New Testament in no part teaches death to adulters. You are confused about the incident when the Pharisees brought the women taken in adultry to Jesus to demand that she be stoned. This was according to the Old Law, not according to New Testament covenent. Jesus was abidng by the Old Testament Law while He lived. It wasn't until after His death that the Old Covenent was fulfilled and the new one began.

Changing the subject or answering a question with a question or playing word games is the tactic of the ignorant and the defeated....usually liberals. Look at BarneyG for example. He is a clown. He has no idea what he is talking about, uses the same talking points over and over (Mission accomplished, come on Barney, that is so 2004) and for the most part is clueless. People like BarneyG come here because they know they cannot have an intelligent debate with like minded individuals over at the far left blogs. BarneyG actually thinks he is challenging us here. This is why he is clueless. I can't even read his full posts because he goes way off topic after two sentences. He is not the only one either. There are a few liberal trolls in here who are incapable of proper debate.

I think you are making an erroneous assumption when you say "If the US lost the war in Iraq, then who won?" is a simple question. The question assumes that having a loser requires having a winner. Everyone involved may end up a loser in this case.

War is not a zero-sum game.

There may be some groups that befit more from the conflict than others, but exactly who they are may take years to resolve.

That's a fair answer, Rance. Pity none of the usual clowns came up with that instead of their customary drivel.

J.

Barney can't help it. BDS has set in and is ingrained in his feeble brain. Hopefully his nanny state will take care of him.

I hate to say it, but I will. Many of the replies to Barney aren't any more civil than the uncivility he brings to the table.

...uncivility that you accuse him of bringing to the table. I wouldn't want to be accused of not having civil behavior. ;)

Doesn't Wizbang encourage its trolls when one of them gets his own page over at Wizbang Blue?

"Mission Accomplished": Bad day for Dems and liberals. They will need to blow up defenseless women and children in Iraq so that Harry can happily go out and claim that the Iraq war is lost.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6610873.stm
Al-Qaeda in Iraq leader 'killed'

metprof, and right is always classy?

On Rosie:

She needs a Betty Ford type retreat to address her fat, ugly, ignorant, and angry issues.
Its still a damned shame that she is responsible for raising a child. Thats pretty cruel!
Posted by: Gianni

I can't stand her but I also can't stand the show putting on a very sick person as entertainment.
Posted by: Judith

it looks like Harry Reid wants to take Rosie's place as the Designated Lunatic on The View.
Not that the other, hmm, women on that show are much more sane.
Posted by: DJ Drummond

Rosie's a mighty fine lookin Bison!
Posted by: 914

I read that transcript and I picture a bunch of barren fat hens...(too harsh?)
Posted by: moseby

That is one angry b#@%$.
Posted by: Jo

Rosie will still be fat and stupid
Posted by: Rodney Dill

Spare me metprof

BarneyG2000,

LOL, so did you vote for Clinton and Kerry? What do you think of homosexuals and marrage? Abortion and voting for any democrat?

Where does your hypocrisy lie?

"As a Catholic, we do not believe in divorce, and adultery is a sin (punishable by death according to the bible both old and new testaments)."

Barney, put down the Koran. You're confused again, as usual.

Heralder,

The answer is that it was a smart move as Canada is now finding out.

Funny thing is Barn, I didn't see anything in your examples about wishing people dead or glad someone has cancer......

What is the purpose of the endless accusations by both sides that the other is classless or ignorant or hateful, ad nauseam?

I read and comment on liberal and conservative blogs and I read commentators from both sides. the truth is both do it - neither side is innocent or more pure or more righteous than the other. One side cites one person from the other and the blog becomes an endless posts of tit for tat.

I don't get it but then I suppose who cares?

BryanD, see engineers comment. I did not say death was the current punishment for adultery just that it was mentioned as a punishment in the new testament. Anyway you look at it, adultery is a sin against God whether you are Jewish, Christian or Muslim. I think that covers everyone involved.

Matthew 19:9 "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."

Mark 10:11 "Anyone who divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her."

Mark 10:12 "And if she divorces her husband and marries another man, she commits adultery."

Luke 16:18 "Anyone who divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery, and the man who marries a divorced woman commits adultery."

As far as my views on abortion, I am against it. I feel that we have wasted 30-years fighting over it when we should have been working together to eliminate the need for an abortion. I will tell you this if you give me the $500-billion we have spent on the war, I bet we could eliminate almost all the abortions performed today and for the next 20-years.

Funny thing is Barn, I didn't see anything in your examples about wishing people dead or glad someone has cancer......
Posted by: metprof at May 1, 2007 12:24 PM

Will this do metpof?

Barney,

You fucking lie. What right do you have to even live in this country? I hope you die.

Posted by: bryanE at April 30, 2007 06:10 PM

Now how about you provide some examples to backup your claims?

Civil discourse with most liberals is not possible at this stage. They and conservatives see the world through two totally different lenses. They can not see each other's frame of reference, so understanding each other's arguement is not likely, except in the infrequent occurances when their frame's overlap.

From what I have seen on the blogs for the last few years the typical lefty will find the cause to a bad effect greater than an individual, while the right will focus on individual responsibility as the cause. This leads to dramatically different conclusions and perceived solutions to a problem.

Obviously, 9-11 is a prime example of this difference, as is fighting crime, addressing poverty, etc...

It's too bad its gotten this bad because it is useful to have both points of view when tackling a problem as a society or community, but the demonization has gone on too long and the gap too big to resolve in the next decade.

What is the purpose of the endless accusations by both sides that the other is classless or ignorant or hateful, ad nauseam?

I think it reinforces the 'us v. them' world view that many political bloggers seem to have. It is far easier to dismiss people with whom you disagree by lumping them into a large group of easily defined morons than it is to find out why they actually disagree with you.

Trolls add spice.

It would be like cooking without any seasonings -- day after day the same boring, tasteless mush.

Trolls provide the inspiration to go on reading, fighting for what you believe in -- they're the inspiration to go on living for Conservative www.Wizbangblog.com readers -- they're the real heroes.

Trolls -- I salute you.

BarneyG2000, your reply is exactly as I would expect. You would seem to believe the cause of abortion does not lie with the responsibility of the individual adults, there is a magic solution if society just funds it.

Besides, how would you eliminate the need for abortions? Not having sex outside of marrage or sterilizing the population? Because we already have a boat load of various birth controls, not that you should be in support of those either.

Really, a great example to my point, thanks.

As far as my views on abortion, I am against it. I feel that we have wasted 30-years fighting over it when we should have been working together to eliminate the need for an abortion. I will tell you this if you give me the $500-billion we have spent on the war, I bet we could eliminate almost all the abortions performed today and for the next 20-years.

Yeah, like the trillions we've spent on the War on Poverty has done mucho to end it. Riiight.

You guys kill me.

I will tell you this if you give me the $500-billion we have spent on the war, I bet we could eliminate almost all the abortions performed today and for the next 20-years.

For that kind of money you could sterilize all women of child bearing age in the U.S. which would eliminate abortions and also solve most environmental problems as well. Of course it would take more than money. You would need a chief supreme grand ayatollah in order to carry out the plan. Maybe that explains why the Democrats plan to fource the U.S. surrender in Iraq.

"Instead, they simply want to repeat ad nauseum the same old talking points (often already thoroughly debunked and discredited)"

The thing is that those "talking points", no matter how thoroughly debunked and discredited, are taken as matters of faith (or the "gospel truth", if you will) to the leftists. Barney or one of the other far leftists you mentioned could post any one of those points on DailyKOS, DU, or HuffPost and they would not be questioned, just as the virgin birth would not be questioned on a Christian blog.

Of course on this site we'd want to point out that these talking points are at best unsubstanciated opinions and most often are outright fabrications. That's the problem with the gospel truth, it's only truth to members of your own religion.

And thanks to the (practically criminally neglegent) MSM most of those disingenuous talking points have become "conventional wisdom". What a sad state this country is in when the conventionally wise are totally ignorant to the facts.

MacLorry, lol.

Um, I think some of you are making J.'s point: Talking about abortion, divorce, etc. is switching the subject AWAY from the subject of, well, switching the subject.

That said, Barney is correct in pointing out that some many righties can be vicious trolls, too. However, some of Barney's examples are lacking context as usual--especailly pointing out Rodney Dill, Judith and 914's comments that are either humorous or reasonable commentary and not name-calling (aka: "slut").

The real issue here, the $1 MM question is:

If the left-right differences are not reconcilable, what is justifiable?

"Changing the subject" is just a small part of the answer to this question. "Accusations by both sides that the other is classless or ignorant or hateful, ad nauseam" is just another small part of the answer. It would appear from my POV the left has continued to increase what is justifiable every election. The right is slow to match, but eventually does.

Where will it end? A destination full of bad it would appear.

MacLorry,

Although my comment was meant as a joke to illustrate Jay's point, I agree with your answer.

I loved Barney comparing our comments of Rosie O'Donnell to his "slut" comment.

Let's see, one has a show on everyday where we see her and hear her comments.

One is the until now, unknown girlfriend of Wolfie.

Oh yeah. Real comparable. lol. Weak, even for Barney.

Of course the determined troll does not remember: " Do not bear false witness...". Truth is truth. There is no in between. If you purposely site someone of doing something more then they did, good or bad, it is a sin.

On the banner: If the trolls are correct that GW put up the banner, it would say War Over, wouldn't it? A mission is a very small part of a war. ww

Jay, the answer to your original post is: Sunni insurgents, Baathists, al Qaeda in Iraq and elsewhere, Iran, Syria and radical muslims worldwide.

I beg pardon from you and Lorie for some of the vitriol I express here sometimes, in defense of the right. I was involved in a conflict which was on the way to being beneficial in outcome. The rug was pulled out from under allies by a Democratic congress who did not wish success to a Republican plan. That I see the same pattern happening here, that is false media coverage and a disloyal opposition, tend to make old vets like me angry. The list of people you posted above serve no real purpose except to dilute honest discussion here. They display both ignorance and dishonesty, refusing edification.

Jo, my Rosie examples were in response to something metprof wrote and not regarding my slut comment. I stand by my comment, and so far nobody has stood up to defend her (Shara and not metprof).

Trolls just like to spout off from their catalog of liberal talking points, just to disrupt the subject at hand.

C'mon, you look at most of the blogs which have an 'open mike' kind of posting, you see the same ones saying the same things over and over. If the subject is abortion, they post anti-Bush things about the Iraq war. If the subject is about highway traffic, they post about Bush not signing the Kyoto treaty. Heck, if the subject was about gardening, the trolls would rehash the 2000 elections again.

There are numerous subjects brought up during the week, and the troll always feel they don't have to actually contribute to the substance of the particular point at hand, unless they can manage to get a dig in at the President.

and if you don't like someone's statement, instead of deciding that you'll just sabotage the remainder of the thread, you can just either rebute the poster or better yet, ignore them.

But then, that is really the point of the trolls: To disrupt and discourage posters who want to have their say, and eventually turn away those who are interested in this and other right-leaning blogs.

BarneyG- Since you are such a devout Catholic, are you against abortion? Or do you just talk the talk?

Kat, I never said I was devout, and I already answered the abortion (trap) question.

BarneyG- cancel that, asked and answered. I need to read ALL of the comments before posting. My bad.

The "Trolls, I salute you" by Adrian was funny.

Kat, that is humorous. BarneyG a devout anything. Does this give you a clue? A misshaped dull witted creature living under a bridge.

BarneyG2000, LOL, not a trap, legitimate questions based on your prior posts and arguments... and you only answered one of the questions.

See, the above is using the leftist methodology of blog commenting. Its easy and irrelevant, just like your catholicism.

Barney
As far as my views on abortion, I am against it.
-------------------------------------------------
So how can you support a party that is supportive of abortion?

Unless one counts the death of the soul, adultery isn't punished by death anywhere that I've ever seen. And I deeply resent BarneyG describing himself as a "devout Catholic" when his comments and language prove quite the opposite. Anyone that filled with hatred and vitriol is not anyone I want to share the Communion rail with!

I was raised to hate the sin and love the sinner - but BarneyG sure makes that a tough one to achieve.

Oh an by the way BarneyG - Catholicism is not a Godless ideology but communism is and you're skating on the brink pal!

horse, I voted for Clinton twice and for Kerry. Clinton's adultery was not known until after the second election. I never said divorce should eliminate someone for holding a job or for running for office. Divorce is far more honorable than cheating on your wife (Reagan, Guiliani). I have not called for Wolfie's resignation for being an adulterer. He is a crook that gave $60K of tax payer money to his mistress.

Believe me I am not a big fan of John Kerry, but considering were we are today as a nation, I made the wise choice.

Yes I believe committed homosexual couples should have the same legal rights as any other married couple. It should be up to each religion/church to decide if they want to perform the sacrament or not.

Barney
I will tell you this if you give me the $500-billion we have spent on the war, I bet we could eliminate almost all the abortions performed today and for the next 20-years.
-------------------------------------------------
We have spent trillions of dollars on the war on poverty. Why do we still have poverty and abortion?

Barney
He is a crook that gave $60K of tax payer money to his mistress.
------------------------------------------------
Dianne Feistein is a a crook that gave millions of dollars of tax payer money to her husband!

Jefferson, a known crook, is still holding a chair position in Congress right now.

Believe me I am not a big fan of John Kerry, but considering were we are today as a nation, I made the wise choice.
------------------------------------------------
Democrats have been acting to aid Bin Laden and his band. Bin Laden basically said after Mogadishu that America will cut and run after a few casualties. The Dem party has been trying to do exactly.

I have been busy to follow the news and the discussion on this forum. Have anyone seen Harry Reid or any other Dem leader making a big announcement after the AlQ leader in Iraq was killed today? Looks like they are waiting for the terrorists to blow up defenseless women and children so that they can hold a press conference proclaiming the war in Iraq is lost. Following this logic, the terrorists will only need to blow up more women/children and the dems will do the propaganda bidding for them.

Is this still a hypocrisy or have they been more open about aligning with the terrorists for American defeat?

LAI, I wrote this yesterday:

Second, is Mr. Feinstein cheating on his wife, or you do you think there has been some corruption? If an investigation is called for then I am all for it. I do not defend corruption in either party.

Posted by: BarneyG2000

As far as abortion here are two ideas:
Give every pregnant women and child (until 18) health insurance
Give every child adopted a $20K state college investment fund (to be used only for education of their choice)

These are just two small investments that would reduce abortions.

Look! A bunny!

Have anyone seen Harry Reid or any other Dem leader making a big announcement after the AlQ leader in Iraq was killed today?

Since al-Masri has "died" several times before and come back to life, and since today's reports of his "death" have yet to be confirmed either by the Iraqi government or the coalition forces, it would be stupid to expect anyone to jump on this yet. And that includes the White House; they've kept their mouths shut so far. Is that because they love terrorists?

BarneyG2000, for clarity, I didn't expect you to actually answer the questions, it was my imitation of a leftist commenter.

But I will say your way of phrasing the situations is a bit of bearing false witness. You have surely read about the situations and know them in detail, which would mean your claims are known false and misleading.

Regarding the institution of marriage, your position is extremely different from your claimed religion.

It would seem from your actions and positions you are rather deep in sin. Doesn't that feel even a little uncomfortable?

that includes the White House; they've kept their mouths shut so far. Is that because they love terrorists?
------------------------------------------------
The White House hasn't come out to proclaim the Iraq war is lost every time the terrorists blowing up the women/children.

Is this difference too hard to see? It seems to me that the Dems are excited when the terrorists blowing more women/children. They seem more eager when the terrorists succeed.

As far as abortion here are two ideas:
Give every pregnant women and child (until 18) health insurance
Give every child adopted a $20K state college investment fund (to be used only for education of their choice)
------------------------------------------------
The liberals will give their own money and their own time to work in the crisis pregnancy center to help the poor, right? Or you are talking about taking other people 's money?

So far we have spent trillions of tax payer money on the war on poverty, why do we still have poverty and abortion?

I am not a Catholic, but from what I learn is that the Catholics consider abortion an "intrinsic" evil. So according to you, if adultry is punishable by death, then abortion should be more so, right?

I saw this happen on usenet a decade ago and left it behind because it had become a cesspool for trolls and halfwits with two barely functioning synaptic nerves to spater fecal matter on everything they touched.
The trolls here are reminicent of those times for exactly the reasons you stated and is one of the primary reasons I stopped coming by here.
I refuse to respond to adhominem attacks, strawdog arguments and feeble attempts at derailing the original argument by changing the subject which are tactics they imploy immeadiatly in their opening comments.
Yeah, the articles are worth the read but until you start tossing the assholes that troll the comments sections it'll be a long cold day in hell before I start reading and commenting on them on a regular basis.

Barney, you only needed to go to the Huffington post they day Tony Snow was diagnosed with a reoccurance of cancer. Two bloggers railed against him and called for his death and stated they were glad he was out of remission. Arianna had the good taste to remove the posts and ban the posters.

btw Barn, you call some woman a slut, some of us here call you on it, and somehow YOU'RE the victim.

Should have figured....

Barney, I still am wishing you an untimely and painful death. All I want you to know is that there is at least one person out there who finds your actions and behavior on this blog so abhorrent that hearing of your death would only make the world a better place.

Tell me why anyone should find value in your worthless life?

Take it easy on Barney, at least he didn't call her a ho.

Gmac,

if only some would see the reason in your ideas.

Personally I hate Mayonnaise. I believe it is the root of all evil. Its even the reason trolls change the subject. If they would just stop all eating mayonnaise, their illogical and disruptive behavior would all go away and we'd all be living and loving together in harmony.

Ban Mayonnaise!

Uh, BTW, what was the original topic here?

metprof, when did I say I was a victim? You asked for an example where someone on the right wished death, disease or injury on someone, and I provided you an example (or see Steve's response above).

All asked for was an example from you to backup your claim, and you can't deliver.

LAI, I said that I could think of better ways to spend the $500-billion (up to $2-trillion projected total) we flushed down the toilet known as Iraq. Health care for children and pregnant women would one, but you already knew that since you read my response.

The above are two examples of how people twist and deceive what was written earlier because they can't admit they are wrong and they try to obscure the initial argument. Fits well with the topic of the post.

Health care for children and pregnant women would one, but you already knew that since you read my response.
------------------------------------------------
You still don't answer my question: we spent trillions of tax payer dollars on the war on poverty, why do we still have poverty and abortion?

For example, I know many conservatives voluntarily give their own money and time to work in crisis pregnancy center to take care of poor women and help with adoption placement.

Even Sean Hanity started the foundation to give 10K dollars to children of fallen soldiers and he has had great success so far.

Yes liberals can do the same. Looks like you are trying to divert the attention from the initial arg. Exactly the point made by Jay.

BTW, we spent trillions of dollars defending Europe. I think I could find better use of that money now. That 's exactly Jay 's point of distraction.

Thanks for proving Jay 's point.

The irony of this post is the frequency with which righty posters hurl "troll" accusations at lefty posters simply for posting opposing views (and thus additionally displaying ignorant misuse of the term "troll"). Nothing changes the subject faster than when the right insults the opposition rather than responding to the merits of their points.

Barney

Clinton's adultery was not known until after the second election.... Divorce is far more honorable than cheating on your wife (Reagan, Guiliani). I have not called for Wolfie's resignation for being an adulterer. He is a crook that gave $60K of tax payer money to his mistress.

How can possibly say any of this as fact? Let's see:
1) Clinton's adultery was not known until after the second election...how do you know? Who didn't know what and when didn't they know it?
2)Divorce is far more honorable than cheating on your wife (Reagan, Guiliani)...according to what authority? Are you married? If so, try that line on your wife sometime, even if you do it in defense of a friend. No, WTH, just run it by her....for grins.
3) Wolfie (is) a crook that gave $60K of tax payer money to his mistress. Cite the offense and what jurisdiction brought the charge.

Brian, I have read most of what you write here and it has no merit. You are not alone.

Barney, what are you still doing here? Wizbang gave you your own house to soil and you continue to dump here. Get out from under that bridge.

Zelsdorf, I didn't ask for someone to demonstrate my point, but thank you for doing so anyway.

Brian is a perfect example of distraction from the main point. Thanks for proving Jay 's point again. Zelsdorf, Brian is simply trying to prove Jay 's point by distracting from the discussion so far.